New to Loaches, but not Tropical Fish

[azfishgal]

With that said, YES, I should have done a little more research before buying my two little guys. My cory's died and I wanted to add some color to my tank so I decided to get clown loaches. My lfs told me not to get the loaches while I still had the cory's, as the loaches would pick on my cory's. Well, I have them now in a Eclipse 12 gallon tank. I KNOW, PLEASE DON'T GO OFF ON ME. My little guys are not 2" yet, so they are not big and from what I understand they grow slow, or do they? I'm learning that I need a MUCH larger tank for these guys to make them happy. Right now they seem to be very happy in my tank with 4 Harlequin, 4 Zebra Danios, and one Blue Gourami. Now, I have always intended on getting a larger tank, but it will probably only be a 50 gallon, maybe 75. Could I still keep my loaches in a 50 gallon tank?! I was planning on taking them back to my lfs and explain to them I can't keep them as my tank is not big enough. BUT, I just love these guys, and they are in a larger tank now with hiding places, unlike the lfs. They have the cutest personalities and I would hate to give them up. How long can I keep them in my current tank without stressing them? How fast do they grow? They have a cave to hide in and plants that go all the way to the top, to shield the light. They are eating good and making that wonderful clicking sound, so they are not acting stressed at this point. Please help as I really don't want to get rid of my new friends.

[Martin Thoene]

Hi there and welcome to LOl.

I get the impression that you have a great desire to do the right thing by your fish, so I suggest the first thing you do is read our species profile. Take what it says very seriously on-board and decide if you can make the necessary commitment to these fish in the long-term.

Clowns grow slowly to full size, but quite quickly up to around 5" of body length. Therefore, your tank will rapidly become too small. It is already truth be known.

If you really like Loaches, there are smaller species that would be OK in a 50 gallon tank, but what you have now is woefully inadequate.

Martin.

[Emma Turner]

Here's the direct link to the profile:
http://community.loaches.com/species-in ... cracanthus

Emma

[Martin Thoene]

Oops! I forgot to put the link in.

Martin.

[azfishgal]

OK, so someone needs to shoot the people at PetsMart that have clown loaches for sale and on the tag it says 10+ gallon. These fish obviously need very large tanks, so I would think they should not be sold at PetsMart at all. I know, PetsMart is not the best place to get my fish, BUT the nearest Tropical fish store is a ways away.

So, if I'm reading everything correctly, unless I get a 75 gallon tank, I should say good-bye to my clown loaches. I really don't want to take them back to PetsMart though, because someone else, who will not care a bit about these fish will toss them in their 10 gallon tank not thinking a thing about it. (Of course, according to PetsMart, that's all they need. )

OK, so back to reality. How long do I have before I need to transfer my clown loaches to a 75 gallon tank? I know today would be the best answer, but how long can I go at the worst? Two weeks, One month, give me a time frame. If for some reason I can't meet the requirements, then I will drive an hour away and give the loaches to a very good Tropical Fish Store, and I know they will not let the fish go to an unsafe home.

[Martin Thoene]

The other issue apart from tank size is numbers of Clowns, which does of course bear relevance to the tank size. You may have noticed the profile stated a minimum of 5.

To be honest, you (and the fish) may be better off taking that hour's drive. If you can contemplate an upgrade to a 75 and 3 more Clowns that would be doable. However, eventually they'll outgrow that too.

As your comments were so strong about Petsmart, you'll probably find this of interest: http://forums.loaches.com/viewtopic.php?t=3943

Martin.

[azfishgal]

I definitely fit the description of a customer reading, thinking I was doing the right thing by what the retailer said on the tag, only to find out later it was wrong. Makes me question everything else about the fish they sell, so I now know to come to an on-line forum and ask questions first before buying.

With all that said, I ran into a tank today that I just fell in love with. It's 125 gallons on an oak stand and would look perfect in my dining room. What better way to eat dinner, but with a water display of beautiful fish. Of course it's $425! Ouch! But, maybe I can sweet talk my husband, lol. Can I get away with only three clown loaches in that tank?

[Martin Thoene]

Well.....I have many more than 3 in a 125. Why would you want to limit yourself to 3 in that sort of tank? As the profile said, they REALLY need the social interactions of a larger group to be truly happy.

When they're happy, they dance.

Yes, reading up on stuff in a fish forum is great research, BUT....we always say that you should get a few opinions. Reason being nobody knows it all and there are variables in anyone's tank that can lead to differences. However, if you come to a specialist site like this for a particular type of fish, you should expect to get the correct info. We can't control every person's opinions on here or the advice they give, but rest assured that if someone tells you something blatantly wrong, the moderators are going to jump on it and put you right.
There are enough people on here who've kept Clowns over many years that you'll get the greatest assembly of practical knowledge on the species right here. I bet the combined years of experience with just that species is way over 100. I've been keeping fish for 42 years so go figure.....

Martin.

[Glostik]

You dont necessarily need a 75 gallon, you just need a tank which is long and deep, height is not an issue for them.

I have 20 in my 150 gallon. Soon to be 25.

[azfishgal]

Martin, those are some beautiful fish you got there! In talking with my hubby I think he's actually going for the 125 gallon tank! So if I have 5-7 loaches in my tank, what kind of Cichlids can I have? My husband likes Oscars (I think those are Cichlids). I would like to have a variety of fish (color and sizes) in my tank. What do you suggest?

[Kitishane]

I am by no means an expert, but from what I have come to understand, keeping cichlids with loaches is a recipe for disaster.

I have heard that the German Blue Ram can work as a tank mate, but I have not heard of any others.

[shari2]

To address the loaches+cichlid issue:

http://community.loaches.com/articles/w ... i-cichlids

[Emma Turner]

You dont necessarily need a 75 gallon, you just need a tank which is long and deep, height is not an issue for them.

I know this was probably in reference to very young clowns, but I just have to point out that the height of the tank is an issue with large adult clowns. The length and width is of course prime consideration, but some thought must be given to height too - seeing my collection of clowns dancing every night using the full 27" height (and sometimes splashing at the surface in all their excitement pre-feeding) makes me think they'd actually like more.....

Emma

[Martin Thoene]

Shari's link to Emma's article specifically addresses the reasons why African Rift-Lake cichlids are incompatible with Clowns.

There are cichlid species that have similar water chemistry requirements. However, the thing you've got to look at is the bigger picture.

People do keep Oscars with Clown Loaches. The problem is, if you buy small Clowns and small Oscars, the Oscars are going to rapidly outgrow the Loaches and become a physical threat to them.

You can keep Clowns with Dwarf Cichlids. Certainly Microgeophagus ramirezi would fit in. The problem then comes from the fact that Clowns need loads of current in their tank that most cichlids will be uncomfortable with.

There's going to have to be a compromise somewhere, but then neither species is being best served. We're biased of course and would always set the tank up for the primary requirements of the Clown Loaches. That requires a lot more investment than just a big tank.

My 125 is filtered by 2 Rena XP3 cannister filters, and an Aquaclear 500 HOB. Then there's additional powerheads, plus a recently added Fluval 4 internal filter. Lots of water movement, mechanical and biological filtration.





Martin.

[azfishgal]

To address the loaches+cichlid issue:

http://community.loaches.com/articles/w ... i-cichlids

That was a very education article. Thanks for sharing.

I think I will be giving my loaches to the lfs store, not the big chain, but the store that will give these guys a good home. I know the store will give me "in-store" credit, so I can use that to put toward my larger tank that I do want to still get. But I think I will stick with more common tropical fish.

Thanks to everyone for giving me a better understanding of these beautiful fish. I will certainly miss them.