Clown loaches with Whitespot

[Lakeland Loach Lover]

Can anybody help? 45litre tans, well established. Introdiced 2 new clowns 3 weeks ago who succumbed to Whitespot within days. Caught early and medicated with 4 day course over 6 days of Waterlife's Protozin (previous success with this). Meds failed - contacted Waterlife and advised to medicate with full dosage for 6 consecutive days and increase temperature. Now Day 6 and fish covered in spots adn 1 Clown not looking to clever, hanging and very lethargic. Waterlife have recommended swapping meds to Octozin.

Has anybody got any advice - I have successfully treated White spot before and never known this sort of persistence.

[Emma Turner]

Hi LLL,

This thread may offer more advice: http://forums.loaches.com/viewtopic.php?t=2599

What temperature is the tank at? Have you increased aeration too? Do you have good filtration on this tank (make/model)?

There has been a more persistent strain of whitespot reported over the last couple of years. I would be inclined to stick to the Protozin at half dose, but dose every 12 hours instead of every 24. That means in one day you will be using the full dose, but in 2 parts spaced 12 hours apart. That is a very good treatment, but it degrades quickly, hence the recommendation to dose more often, but at half strength.

Good luck,

Emma

[Lakeland Loach Lover]

Thanks Emma

I think I may try that as I think switching meds may be even more troublesome. Temp cranked up to 84 yesterday, had increased to 80 over past week but then got scared of frying them! Filtration is Fluval 2, well established. HAve dropped water level 1 inch or so to allow splash - plenty of movement and bubbles on surface.

Do you think I should do any water changes before I start what effectively will be the 3rd course of Protozin?

Thanks for you advice
Linda

[Emma Turner]

Hi Linda,

I would be inclined to carry out a fairly good sized water change (25-30%) before commencing the next round of treatment. If you have a gravel substrate, do a really thorough vaccuuming at the time you are changing the water, make sure there is no activated carbon in the filter (which will absorb the meds) and then start treating again.

The Fluval 2 isn't a particularly powerful filter, so I would think about upgrading sometime soon. You probably already know this, but the clown loaches are going to require a much larger tank sooner rather than later too.

Other people here have had much success using aquatic salt, but this is not something I would do myself or would recommend. The decision would be up to you, as is the decision to carry on with the same medication. I believe Protozin to be one of the best whitespot treatments on the market though. You also need to establish why they got whitespot in the first place, as if something in the tank has/is stressing them out (water conditions, tankmates, lack of hiding places etc) then this needs to be remedied asap. Of course they may have become stressed when being caught and moved, but its best to check everything else is fine.

Emma

[Lakeland Loach Lover]

Hi Emma

Have done water change, added an airstone, boutght a new bottle of Protozin (on the grounds that I might have got a bad batch- long shot I know), vaccumed and taken decorations out to clean & immerse in boiling water.

Still all covered in fuzzy spots - hopefully no new spots have arrived. 1 Clown still looking very poorly - hoping (!) he will hang in there.

Decided to avoid salt - these guys have been through enough already.
Presume I imported the WS from the 2 new Clowns - all water parameters are good.

Many thanks for the advice/interest - keep you fingers crossed!
LLL

[Tinman]

Temp cranked up to 84 yesterday, had increased to 80 over past week but then got scared of frying them!

No worrys of that till 88-92F. I held mine at 90F for three weeks and got as high as 93F for short durations at times with a sticky heater,you must come back down VERY slowly and increase aeration though as low O2 is the real problem at high temps.What filters do you have,dropping the water level increase aggitation on many styles, With the ich on the gills your fish are having trouble breathing so massive aggitation is very benaficial.

[Lakeland Loach Lover]

Thanks for the interest - wonder if I should turn tank up further then? Now at 84f. Filteration is Fluval 2 plus, have dropped the water level so plently of splash, and added a little air pump with 1 air stone last night. Could add another stone off the same pump - would that increase O2 or just split it between the 2 stones? Fish enjoying Jaccuzzi! All 3 Clowns still in a bad way - difficult to tell how many spots as I have turned lighting off to try and reduce stress- 1 inparticular struggling but still alive -unbelievably.

Also got Zebra Danios and pencil tetras in the tank - would they be OK with increased temperature - they do not seem to be effected by the WS at all.

Still adding Protozin half a dose twice daily.

[Diana]

I would be continuing the water changes. As the Ich fall off the fish they fall to the bottom of the tank to reproduce. I have heard of complete cures using nothing but vacuuming the bottom. The emphasis is on removing the parasites that land on the bottom. Daily when the temp is so high. It is not so much the total volume of water changed, but how thoroughly you can clean the bottom.

An ultra violet sterilizer can help, too. This will kill the babies as they swim around looking for a host.

I would not split the air into two bubblers unless the first one is going REALLY strong. Then there might be some benefit to having two areas with more water movement. If the bubbler is just sort of going OK, then splitting it will create two spots with even less water movement. The pump has a hard time pushing the air down against the water pressure. Asking a small pump to do it twice might just stop the whole system.
An alternate to more bubblers might be a bubble wand. In this small a tank, though just a short one would probably be enough.

Zebra Danios are cooler water fish that are probably not too happy with a temperature over 80 degrees, but as long as they are not gasping at the surface keep things as they are.

[henry]

I have to agree with diane

For Ich I rely alot on my Diatom as it will filter out ich parasites. I don't increase the temp. I add additional air stones as alot of attachments will be in the gills. Increasing the temp speeds the reproductive cycle of the parasite. Not increasing the temp, increases the duration ich will remain (in numbers ) in your tank, but gives you more time to vacuum out the parasites. If your fish have alot of attachements use previously de-cloramined water, cloramine will be hard on respiration too.Not increasing the temp will provide more o2 for your fish. I believe most fish sufficate from attachments in the gills. If you are keeping your fish at the correct temp for the species and their immune system, why increase temp?

I know this is not a popular position, but it works well for me.

[Lakeland Loach Lover]

Hi All

Thanks for the advice - done another 20% water change tonight and added half a dose of Protozin (half a dose added this morning). Clowns looking fuzzy - can only see 2 of them, other may be in his hiding place so did not disturb. Did not find a corpse whilst vaccuming - phew!

I don't have a UV steriliser so at the moment that is not an option unfortunately.

This must be some powerful strain of Ich - it seems unbelievably hard to get it under control. Thought fish keeping was supposed to be relaxing - this week has been a rollercoaster - people at work cannot believe how attached I am to my Clowns, but then they don't know how much fun these guys can be (when they are fit & well). See what tomorrow brings...