I recently bought three new clown loach, I am quite new to fish keeping and had originally bought just two, which I have kept successfully for approx three years. I did not quarantine the new fish as they came from a recommended source however i noticed one in particular scratching straight away, after a day or two spots started to show and I treated the tank but unfortunately lost all three young ones.
I have noticed the smaller of my original two scratching now , which is approx a month after losing the others, I didn't finish treating the tank after losing them as it seemed pointless as none of the other fish had shown any symptoms but I had treated three times with Protozin with a reduced dose due to the new fish being so small.
I had recently noticed the same fish was sunken behind the head, and have now come to realise it also has skinny disease My question is which do I treat first or can I get a treatment for both? I assume the fish has caught the ich due to lowered immunity. But which is the worse??
I live in the uk and have read that some medication is only available from a vets.
Many thanks for your help
Clown loach with ich and skinny disease
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Re: Clown loach with ich and skinny disease
Ich can kill really fast, so I would prioritize this way:
1) Treat for Ich. I do not think meds for Ich (external parasite) also work against internal parasites. Some might, but usually Ich is treated with medicines that kill the Ich organism as it swims in the water looking for a host. Worming meds kill the worms in the host's digestive tract. A medication that kills Ich from inside the fish would have to enter the fish's blood stream and get carried to the skin from the inside.
A) Fish under stress may produce more ammonia than average, so keep a close eye on the water tests and do water changes as needed. If this interrupts the medication schedule then dose to replace the medicine so it stays at therapeutic levels. Also, fish under stress may not be able to maintain a good osmotic balance of water:minerals/salts in their cells. Adding 1 teaspoon of salt (sodium chloride) per 10 gallons of water can help them with this. (5 ml per 40 liters is a pretty close metric equivalent) Read the label to be sure the medicine is OK with a little salt in the water. This is a low level, and is usually OK for most aquarium plants. When the treatment is done quit using salt.
B) While doing the medical treatments be sure to do thorough and complete aquarium cleaning, vacuuming the floor of the tank really well. Ich and internal parasites can be found on the floor of the tank, and many breed there, then re-infest the fish. By keeping as much organic material out of the tank as possible you are also giving the medications a better chance to actually reach the disease organisms. Keep the filter clean, too. Remember that any build up of debris in the filter is really still in the aquarium system. Rinse the filter media with water removed from the tank for a water change.
2) When Ich treatment is complete do 2 water changes of 50% each within 12 hours and add activated carbon to the filter for 24 hours. Then begin the next treatment. Never combine medicines unless both meds are labeled for use with each other.
3) The next treatment is for skinny disease. The basic concepts are:
Internal parasites might be any of several worms or related parasites, and you do not know which. Any one worming medicine does not kill all the different types of worms. Get one that seems to kill a wide range of worms. Levamisol has been recommended because along with killing several common parasites it may also boost the immune system. However, I think this is one of the harder to get medicines in the UK.
Alternate anti-bacterial medicines with worming medicines. For example:
Treat with a worming medicine according to the label for dose, duration, and repeating. Often it will be something like:
Medicate for 3 days. Then do water change. A week later medicate for 3 days, then water change... and so on.
In between worming treatments, use antibiotics. Often the directions for the antibiotics are: Medicate for 5 days, then water change, repeat if needed.
See how the timing can work by alternating the treatments? Do perhaps 3 full worming treatments (maybe using 2 different products) and 2 courses of antibiotics. In between every treatment do the 2 water changes + activated carbon to clear the meds from the water.
4) At this point I would give the fish a break from medications. Feed a good blend of foods so there are proteins and vegetables, and several different sorts. This assures the fish are getting a good mix of vitamins, minerals, proteins, carbs and fats. If you are feeding a dry food (flakes, pellets or freeze-dried things) you can add liquid vitamins. One type is sold for caged birds. Another sort (in USA, anyway) is a garlic-and-vitamin mix. Some fish are tempted to eat food that is garlic flavored even if they are not too interested in eating. I don't know if liquid vitamins soaks into foods that are already wet (frozen or fresh foods), but it is worth a try.
1) Treat for Ich. I do not think meds for Ich (external parasite) also work against internal parasites. Some might, but usually Ich is treated with medicines that kill the Ich organism as it swims in the water looking for a host. Worming meds kill the worms in the host's digestive tract. A medication that kills Ich from inside the fish would have to enter the fish's blood stream and get carried to the skin from the inside.
A) Fish under stress may produce more ammonia than average, so keep a close eye on the water tests and do water changes as needed. If this interrupts the medication schedule then dose to replace the medicine so it stays at therapeutic levels. Also, fish under stress may not be able to maintain a good osmotic balance of water:minerals/salts in their cells. Adding 1 teaspoon of salt (sodium chloride) per 10 gallons of water can help them with this. (5 ml per 40 liters is a pretty close metric equivalent) Read the label to be sure the medicine is OK with a little salt in the water. This is a low level, and is usually OK for most aquarium plants. When the treatment is done quit using salt.
B) While doing the medical treatments be sure to do thorough and complete aquarium cleaning, vacuuming the floor of the tank really well. Ich and internal parasites can be found on the floor of the tank, and many breed there, then re-infest the fish. By keeping as much organic material out of the tank as possible you are also giving the medications a better chance to actually reach the disease organisms. Keep the filter clean, too. Remember that any build up of debris in the filter is really still in the aquarium system. Rinse the filter media with water removed from the tank for a water change.
2) When Ich treatment is complete do 2 water changes of 50% each within 12 hours and add activated carbon to the filter for 24 hours. Then begin the next treatment. Never combine medicines unless both meds are labeled for use with each other.
3) The next treatment is for skinny disease. The basic concepts are:
Internal parasites might be any of several worms or related parasites, and you do not know which. Any one worming medicine does not kill all the different types of worms. Get one that seems to kill a wide range of worms. Levamisol has been recommended because along with killing several common parasites it may also boost the immune system. However, I think this is one of the harder to get medicines in the UK.
Alternate anti-bacterial medicines with worming medicines. For example:
Treat with a worming medicine according to the label for dose, duration, and repeating. Often it will be something like:
Medicate for 3 days. Then do water change. A week later medicate for 3 days, then water change... and so on.
In between worming treatments, use antibiotics. Often the directions for the antibiotics are: Medicate for 5 days, then water change, repeat if needed.
See how the timing can work by alternating the treatments? Do perhaps 3 full worming treatments (maybe using 2 different products) and 2 courses of antibiotics. In between every treatment do the 2 water changes + activated carbon to clear the meds from the water.
4) At this point I would give the fish a break from medications. Feed a good blend of foods so there are proteins and vegetables, and several different sorts. This assures the fish are getting a good mix of vitamins, minerals, proteins, carbs and fats. If you are feeding a dry food (flakes, pellets or freeze-dried things) you can add liquid vitamins. One type is sold for caged birds. Another sort (in USA, anyway) is a garlic-and-vitamin mix. Some fish are tempted to eat food that is garlic flavored even if they are not too interested in eating. I don't know if liquid vitamins soaks into foods that are already wet (frozen or fresh foods), but it is worth a try.
38 tanks, 2 ponds over 4000 liters of water to keep clean and fresh.
Happy fish keeping!
Happy fish keeping!
Re: Clown loach with ich and skinny disease
Thank you for your response Diana, i will get straight onto it and keep you informed of my progress. 
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