The Dream Tank Begins

[The Skinny Chef]

Hello Hello!

obviously there is much more experience here in river tanks than in TPT so i'm sure i will get better adivce and thoughts here.

I've been dreaming up a River tank (or something similar) in my mind since i first laid eyes on a Hillstream loach. My plan is to take a 40B and make my tank. what i was originally thinking is to take a piece of slate or flagstone, and have it cut in into a s shaped river bed, and then to lay it from front to back in the tank, and surround it with sand. then take a canister filter for 175g tank and run the flow from that onto the riverbed. and then use a canister filter for 55g to do the actual filtration and have that run from left to right across the tank. i have seen the plans for the river flow that was created here and i am planning on doing a modified version of that with the canister.

this is will be a multi-species tank that include the loachs, bamboo and vampire shrimp, rummy nose tetras, corys, and a family of double red agazzi cichlids. (this is basically upgrading a already running tank.)

[The Skinny Chef]

any advice?

[shuwae]

In my opinion, hillstream loaches are better off being in a tank by themselves as the temperature range is different from the "tropical" fish in community tanks. I keep my loaches in the high 60s to about 72F/74F. I found that other fish will pick on the loaches and try to skin them. That's why I do not keep anything that can pick on the hillstream loaches. I have even seen goldfish eat the skins off sewellia lineolatas at a LFS. Make sure you have a lot of oxygen for the fish as the more you have, the happier they are. There are some hobbyists who have kept hillstream fish in community tanks but they do not last long from what I have seen. Certain species can live to be over 8 years or more. Have plenty of algae also as the hillstream loaches like to graze on it but are not great algae eaters. I am not sure on filtration as I believe the more you have, the happier the fish are if they are from river habitats. I have 2 canisters rated for 100 gallons each, 1 powerhead, and 1 wavemaker for my 40 breeder.

[The Skinny Chef]

i've been keeping them in that set up with those fish for about 8 months give or take, at this point i have not seen the aggression you speak of. so i would imagine i will be okay migrating everyone one to larger tank. i tend to keep my tank in the 72/74 range, thats about as cold as i can get a tank here in texas without purchasing a chiller. i run a power head almost 24/7 that also has a air line to help oxygenate the water plus the 55g canister on the 29g tank. in the 40b i will be adding a canister rated for a 175g, plus the 55g canister and power head.

i had no idea loaches could live 8 years....new fact for the day . as for the algae, that outdated photo i posted has some smooth rocks that contain algae, and i will be culturing more algae on them when the new tank is ready.

[The Skinny Chef]

i guess my question is, is one large smooth rock river bed better than a bunch of varying size like your river tanks?

[The Skinny Chef]

any thoughts on this? anyone?

[bookpage]

IMO, I would rather have many small to medium rocks than just one big one. More area for algae to gown also.

[f1sleepy]

Many smaller rocks gives hillstream fishes (and any other bottom dwellers that like rocks for that matter) more areas to hide and feel comfortable on. Having said that, many of the hillstream loaches seem to be found in areas where the bottom of the stream is essentially a smooth rock surface. They definitely don't NEED small stones, but it is helpful in such a small habitat like an aquarium. As far as keeping them in a community tank, as long as the essential requirements are met and there are no aggressive fish to harass the loach(es) then you should be okay. There absolutely must be a high concentration of O2, great circulation is needed and depending on what species of loach you have, water temp is a consideration. Sewellia species are much more hardy and capable of living in warmer water than most people give them credit for. If the proper Oxygen content and water flow are there, then they should be able to live quite happily in water that is in the 78 F* temperature range. Other species like gastromyzon and pseudogastromyzon tend to be much more sensitive to their environment in my experience, they seem to be much more happy in sub-tropical temperatures.

[The Skinny Chef]

Many smaller rocks gives hillstream fishes (and any other bottom dwellers that like rocks for that matter) more areas to hide and feel comfortable on. Having said that, many of the hillstream loaches seem to be found in areas where the bottom of the stream is essentially a smooth rock surface. They definitely don't NEED small stones, but it is helpful in such a small habitat like an aquarium. As far as keeping them in a community tank, as long as the essential requirements are met and there are no aggressive fish to harass the loach(es) then you should be okay. There absolutely must be a high concentration of O2, great circulation is needed and depending on what species of loach you have, water temp is a consideration. Sewellia species are much more hardy and capable of living in warmer water than most people give them credit for. If the proper Oxygen content and water flow are there, then they should be able to live quite happily in water that is in the 78 F* temperature range. Other species like gastromyzon and pseudogastromyzon tend to be much more sensitive to their environment in my experience, they seem to be much more happy in sub-tropical temperatures.

that was my thinking that because they are found in an area with a smooth rock surface it would make a more ideal set up to replicate that. but i wasn't even thinking about small rocks giving them hiding places to make them feel safe. which i think would be very important since my plan is a community tank.

i'm not worried about flow/circulation,but im not quite sure how i can increase my O2, the river manifold doesn't really increase O2, or is it just the high flow and cooler temp that does that?

[Loachloach]

i'm not worried about flow/circulation,but im not quite sure how i can increase my O2, the river manifold doesn't really increase O2, or is it just the high flow and cooler temp that does that?

High flow distributed everywhere around the tank, lots of water surface movement, the lower temps, low organics, all contribute to more oxygen in the water.

[f1sleepy]

High surface agitation and even adding air via air stones or through a powerhead venturi will increase oxygen saturation in the water.

[Direwolf82]

I drilled out a few holes in my river tank manifold, I did the same as you and used a cannister filter, and put some airlines into the outflow piping near the return nozzles. Now I have strong water flow and a butt ton of bubbles that my loaches love,
It reminds me of the bottom of waterfall in a brook in new hampshire I grew up with.

[The Skinny Chef]

I drilled out a few holes in my river tank manifold, I did the same as you and used a cannister filter, and put some airlines into the outflow piping near the return nozzles. Now I have strong water flow and a butt ton of bubbles that my loaches love,
It reminds me of the bottom of waterfall in a brook in new hampshire I grew up with.

is there any reason you didn't plump the air line in before the canister? i'm thinking that having it in before the canister would give the impeller a chance to mix in some of the bubbles into the water.

could you post a photo of how you have it set up?

[Direwolf82]

I am unable to post pics, sorry.
I didn't want to put the airline in before the filter for fear of the cavitation making the pump unbearably loud. Also I didn't want to tax the motor more than needed. As it is the bubble system is a bit noisier than I was hoping it would be, but the fish are happy so I can live with it. I want to install a small super fine airstone in the pump return line, I think this will give me more fine bubbles but I also run an airstone in the tank that the manifold blows over top of so that would really be overkill.
I would like to see pics of your setup, maybe I can offer a suggestion or get an idea from how you put yours together, I am a plumber and moving water around is how I make my money so I'm not to shabby with it. Send me a private message and I can email you pics of my setup if you'd like.

[The Skinny Chef]

still waiting on my friend to finish the rock, he is expecting to be done by the end of the month.....i'm waiting on that to get measurments to figure out how much sand i will need, and such. i'm thinking about getting the current LED plus fixture.

i have the old canister now cycled, i plumbed into the filtration on the old tank to get it cycled.