Sterilizing my loach tank

[Icewall42]

So, I had a second mass death of my fish... I don't have many left. This is the second time this has happened in the same month, so I'm breaking the tank down completely for total sterilization. I plan on baking all the sand in the oven at 300F for about 15-20 minutes, and I'm boiling the rocks and driftwood, and I put the live plants in an anti-protozoan bath overnight.

I'm just not sure about the tank itself. I've seen people recommend bleach, but I'm not sure I like the idea of that since I can't take this tank into a yard to hose down. The only thing I can think to do right now is to fill the tank with blistering hot/boiling water and let it sit for a while. I don't think I can afford UV sterilization.

What should I do? I live in an apartment, so my possibilities are restricted.

[pierydys]

I'd be interested in finding out if there are alternatives as well, since I really don't like dealing with chlorinated bleach and any traces it might leave. Plus the same space issues that you have. I've heard of hydrogen peroxide being used for sterilization (2 oz to the gallon) -- that just decomposes into oxygen and water. Might just go for that unless somebody has a better idea?

[Icewall42]

That sounds like a good idea (the hydrogen peroxide). What do others think?

[hemi]

anyone can afford UV
http://www.aquatraders.com/index.asp
i only ran mine when the lights were on
i dont have it on my tank atm cuz the fish in there never get sick
oh and i dont mean my loach tank either

i dont like bleach either
i wouldnt put hot boiling water into my tank either
it could shatter
you could let it dry up
but i dunno if that will help kill everything
then clean it with vineager and salt

[Mark in Vancouver]

I would boil, rather than bake, the decor and substrate. You're sure to get pure results by boiling items. As for the tank, the larger the aquarium, the harder it is to rinse properly - but that's all that is required, even if you use bleach. If you can get it outdoors and just hose the hell out of it, you'll be fine. It's one chance to get the glass very, very clean.

[Icewall42]

Shoot the shattering bit is true... I didn't think of that. Axe boiling water.

But hot water should help it. I can get that into the tank from the faucet. Pretty sure that won't shatter the glass, since I've heat-rinsed tanks before when I used to have a lawn.

Vinegar... not sure about it. I just really worry about leaving traces of anything in the tank, and would the vinegar really kill what's in there? Have you used it before?

The other thing I was thinking, is maybe I can fill the tank and dump that anti-protozoan formalin + malachite green into it, and let it sit for a while, then drain it all out... except the problem there is that there's always about an inch of water I can't get out of the bottom. Darn...

Edit: I can possibly try getting it to my boyfriend's parents' house to hose it down... then I can go ahead and bleach it, hose it to death, and feel more certain that I've killed off the disease.

Also, I don't know if it makes a difference, but I baked the sand while it was wet, not dry.

[Mark in Vancouver]

Please don't use the malachite/formalin for sterilization purposes! This stuff is not good for anybody, and should not be used at all unless you have no other option. It will not sterilize the tank, and nor will hot water. You need to use boiling water or steam to do this. Bleach will do it just as well. I would use about a quarter cup of bleach per gallon of tank space in luke warm water. Then just rinse the tank very thoroughly.

Malachite/formalin is a serious carcinogen and should not be used casually. Flushing it down the drain is a fairly unscrupulous thing to do. And it won't achieve what you have in mind.

[Icewall42]

Wow okay... I was hoping someone could give me good information about that. I just really worry about the bleach getting stuck in a place I can't rinse (like underneath the sealant!) but it looks like my only sure bet... I never used the formalin on the fish. I told myself if the modestas didn't improve, it would be my last resort. But thankfully I didn't have to.

If the stuff is so bad, why aren't there more warnings on the labels of the stuff? Should these companies be alerted about it??

[Mark in Vancouver]

The combination of the two chemicals can be very useful for curing Ich, but it also makes for a very nasty poison. I believe it is banned in CA because of the carcinogenic content. I bought it once and the packaging up here was explicit - don't even use it in the house if anybody's pregnant.

It's used in very diluted doses, but it will compromise the health of your fish. Last ditch only.

[Icewall42]

Wow... the stuff I bought only says that it's know by the State of California to cause cancer. But I'm going to hang on to it just in case I go through this again, with nothing else working. I wish, however, that the packaging said something more about how dangerous it is (for fish and people. Heck it doesn't even mention half-dosing for loaches!) and that it should be disposed of carefully, and that hands should be thoroughly washed in skin contact is made.

Is there an article on LOL about it?

[Martin Thoene]

Dilution is the solution to pollution.

How big is this tank? Unless it's huge or you're completely wimpy, you should be able to empty down to the few inches of water you're talking about and then lift one end of the tank and place it on a support of some kind (block of wood, a big book or something) Then all your residual water sits up the other end and you'lI find you can syphon almost all of it only leaving a couple of cup fulls or so. Get your b/f to help

I would empty the tank like this, place it back flat, then partially refill with a reasonably strong bleach solution. Wear old clothes in case you splash Clean everywhere well, including up under the top frame trim. Let it sit for a little while, then drain the tank again, including the tilt procedure.

Place flat again. When you do water-changes you use dechlorinator right? Works on bleach......because it's chlorine Refill the tank with fresh water right up to the top trim and throw in loads more dechlorinator than you would normally use (like 2 or 3 times the regular dosage.
Let it sit for an hour or so then fully drain again.

If that doesn't do the job, I don't know what will. It means that you don't have to go carrying the tank anywhere which always increases the risk factor. Plus you're using relatively innocuous products.

Martin.

[Icewall42]

That sounds like a pretty good procedure for our limited space. The tank is an all-glass 72 gallon bow front, so I think it weighs something like 50-70lbs empty, a bit more with the remaining water. And yes, I do use the dechlorinator, I have lots of it. If I do it like this, it would save me a whole lot of trouble trying to move it.

I'll use the dilution that Mark suggests, and the tilt procedure that you're suggesting Martin. It's such a heavy tank, but I think two of us can do it.

[pierydys]

Hmmm. Still considering this, since it'd have to be done in my carpeted bedroom upstairs. Hate to move it because it's right next to the bathroom, which makes siphoning easy, so this *would* solve the problem as long as I'm very *very* careful... I'm only working with a 60 gal, but it's also just one foot shorter than me -- I actually lugged it up the stairs by putting it over my head and shoulders, then walking it up really really slowly... it's interesting seeing the tank from inside Don't know if I'm up to getting back up and down the stairs again, and sneaking the boyfriend in to help would be an even bigger deal, as far as the family is concerned. Too much thumping and splashing for comfort, as it were One of the many reasons for moving out before the upgrade to 120g happens...

I suppose the bleach has to be unscented? Because I've got gallons of the flowery stuff in the laundry.

Oh! For the dechlorinator, what brands do you recommend? I've been using AquaPlus, but was unsure if it was one of the ones that messed with water tests or not?

[Martin Thoene]

Sounds like you moved the tank like portaging a canoe

Yes, just use regular cheapo bleach......no smellies.

I can't recommend a specific brand of dechlorinator because I don't use a commercially available brand. I have a big 1kg tub of Anhydrous Sodium Thiosulphate powder which I dissolve, then use like regularly bought stuff. Probably got enough to last me the rest of my life......no joke.

Martin.

[mikev]

Bleach is really the best bet. It will take care of bacteria and may even take out some worm eggs, no other cleansing substance will do this.

UV does not clean the ground.

Mal Green/Formalin: while I'm not sure about the cancerogenic danger, they are simply not the best disinfectants around.

Viable alternative to Bleach: Meth Blue, Peroxide, Permoxyn. I use Meth Blue+Permoxyn to clean items that are moved between the tanks here: it is sufficiently strong to kill bacteria and protozoa, and I can rinse it off quickly. Boiling is really the only 100% guaranteed option around.

It is very important to know what the problem was in the tank. Often, simply running the tank empty for a month will clean it. But otoh nematode eggs may be present for a long time and survive bleaching. Some bacteria can encapsulate and survive for weeks and months too (usually in the ground). Knowing the cause allows you to chose the right way to disinfect.

hth.