gastromyzon ocellatus - video
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Hi all!
Jim,I am splendid with seven years for a breeding period!
Ocellatus is shortest-lived in the Gastromyzon genus by my tank.
Unfortunately there is not yet that I was able to keep them alive more than two years.
I think that the reason is because the setting of the water temperature is too high.
The water temperature is kept 25-26 degrees Celsius with a chiller and a heater, but low temperature looks better.
Is your water temperature around several degrees Celsius?
It is pleasant that I choose the fish of various patterns and breed it.
But there are many fish that a pattern and the color of the body turn big all over the breeding period.
Even if the creature is the same species, It has potence to bring about the extremely various appearance.
For example, it is from the appearance of the kinds such as a goldfish, a guppy, the dog and is hard to believe that they are the same species.
On the contrary, it may not be the same species even if a person looks, and appearance is the totally same.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptic_species_complex
Many of past identification and creature classifications are revised by the rapid progress and spread of DNA analysis technology of these past several years.
Therefore I have lost interest to the method to distinguish a close species based on a delicate difference of the appearance.
I introduce their pictures which were able to trouble me in the past in a mass.
I regret that I should have stored not only their pictures but also the organization sample.
Jim Powers wrote:I have a few of what I have always thought were ocelatus, but as the fish aged and grew, the markings have become more like farragus.
By my experience, their pattern changed in the same way as you.plaalye wrote:It also did the pattern change from typical occelatus to the more spotted/farragus looking pattern.
Jim,I am splendid with seven years for a breeding period!
Ocellatus is shortest-lived in the Gastromyzon genus by my tank.
Unfortunately there is not yet that I was able to keep them alive more than two years.
I think that the reason is because the setting of the water temperature is too high.
The water temperature is kept 25-26 degrees Celsius with a chiller and a heater, but low temperature looks better.
Is your water temperature around several degrees Celsius?
It is pleasant that I choose the fish of various patterns and breed it.
But there are many fish that a pattern and the color of the body turn big all over the breeding period.
Even if the creature is the same species, It has potence to bring about the extremely various appearance.
For example, it is from the appearance of the kinds such as a goldfish, a guppy, the dog and is hard to believe that they are the same species.
On the contrary, it may not be the same species even if a person looks, and appearance is the totally same.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptic_species_complex
Many of past identification and creature classifications are revised by the rapid progress and spread of DNA analysis technology of these past several years.
Therefore I have lost interest to the method to distinguish a close species based on a delicate difference of the appearance.
I introduce their pictures which were able to trouble me in the past in a mass.
I regret that I should have stored not only their pictures but also the organization sample.
I am not used to English. Therefore,It is likely to sometimes misunderstand it.
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Jim Powers
- Posts: 5208
- Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:15 pm
- Location: Bloomington, Indiana
Thanks Jim !
The Japanese summer is hot like the tropical zone.
Furthermore, I light it up strongly to multiply algae.
An electricity bill improves more when I lower the setting temperature of the chiller, but will lower the setting temperature of the chiller once when I keep ocellatus on the next time.
The Japanese summer is hot like the tropical zone.
Furthermore, I light it up strongly to multiply algae.
An electricity bill improves more when I lower the setting temperature of the chiller, but will lower the setting temperature of the chiller once when I keep ocellatus on the next time.
I am not used to English. Therefore,It is likely to sometimes misunderstand it.
My tanks are also kept at 24-26c but I don't have he same results as Jim. More like you odyssey. I can't keep them for more than a year it seems. I'm counting on this one i have now though as it's an aggressive feeder!
No problems between the ocellatus and the stiphodons Charles. The stiphodons chase each other just a bit for dominance and the best feeding rock, very much like gastros do. That little ocellatus hold it's own in any battle!
No problems between the ocellatus and the stiphodons Charles. The stiphodons chase each other just a bit for dominance and the best feeding rock, very much like gastros do. That little ocellatus hold it's own in any battle!
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Jim Powers
- Posts: 5208
- Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:15 pm
- Location: Bloomington, Indiana
I think one of the keys in keeping any hillstream has more to do with the fish itself. If they don't make the "leap" from awfuchs and algae based natural diet to commercially sold fish foods and frozen foods, they will probably not make it long term.
I have no idea why some fish make the change to prepared foods and some don't. Most of my tanks have been grazed to the point that there is not much algae so its essential that the fish adapt to this new diet.
Most of the time, this takes about 3-4 weeks with gastromyzons, but the fish in the fourth picture of mine, took a year or so. Now, he, like the others, greedily eats bloodworms and brine shrimp. The others also eat pelleted foods but I have never seen this fish do that. After he adapted to prepared and frozen foods, he really began to grow.
Sewellia, Pseudogastromyzons, and Liniparhomaloptera disparis, all seem to adapt to prepared foods very quickly. I have heard some Sewellia owners, however, report that, even though the fish looked healthy, they noticed little, if any feeding on prepared foods and much algae grazing. I suspect the fish are picking up bits of food around the tank and are getting more of the food without being noticed.
I have no idea why some fish make the change to prepared foods and some don't. Most of my tanks have been grazed to the point that there is not much algae so its essential that the fish adapt to this new diet.
Most of the time, this takes about 3-4 weeks with gastromyzons, but the fish in the fourth picture of mine, took a year or so. Now, he, like the others, greedily eats bloodworms and brine shrimp. The others also eat pelleted foods but I have never seen this fish do that. After he adapted to prepared and frozen foods, he really began to grow.
Sewellia, Pseudogastromyzons, and Liniparhomaloptera disparis, all seem to adapt to prepared foods very quickly. I have heard some Sewellia owners, however, report that, even though the fish looked healthy, they noticed little, if any feeding on prepared foods and much algae grazing. I suspect the fish are picking up bits of food around the tank and are getting more of the food without being noticed.
hi all
the question of id is very interesting indeed. essential is perhaps the collecting of observations and experiences because - in case of gastromyzon (and others too) - the breeding questions are important as time runs short. every week I'm talking with exoerienced breeders about the feeding question as one of the basic problems for most species. sometimes with interesting input. for example: at high temperatures hillstream-loaches can't eat enough to cover the energy-loss as steadily moving organisms, therefore they attack their fat-supply. this could explain, that hillstream-loaches - after weeks wtihout food, stocked at relatively high temperatures - don't really start immediately eating in the importer's tanks, are shocked, week and not very active. some importers say: they don't eat much anyway! my experience says, they eat steadily when settled and with the right offer. in a certain way they have to restart the digestive tract.
unfortunately a hillstream-design is not made to see much to jugde a specimen's body condition. you remember hypergastromyzon cf humilis I presented? not so eager at the food-search, I thought, that's perhaps species-like. didn't make it. that's hard to swallow.
last year I bought a few specimen with outstanding dorsal skeleton out of a LFS-tank to try it. all died (1 exeption).
just two examples. guess which one survived ...
all started to eat. I won't repeat this for shure because even the best input can't save them
another problem is the offer itself: dry food, which contains ordinary mammal meat is not the right thing. I heard some pellets have the same effect. it's turned to grease and burdens the liver. a long life is not to be expected, nor breeding.
Jim, you are certainly doing it the right way. what about some more details on the complete keeping complex? I'm shure after 7 years of keeping a certain specimen you have a lot to report?
cheers charles
the question of id is very interesting indeed. essential is perhaps the collecting of observations and experiences because - in case of gastromyzon (and others too) - the breeding questions are important as time runs short. every week I'm talking with exoerienced breeders about the feeding question as one of the basic problems for most species. sometimes with interesting input. for example: at high temperatures hillstream-loaches can't eat enough to cover the energy-loss as steadily moving organisms, therefore they attack their fat-supply. this could explain, that hillstream-loaches - after weeks wtihout food, stocked at relatively high temperatures - don't really start immediately eating in the importer's tanks, are shocked, week and not very active. some importers say: they don't eat much anyway! my experience says, they eat steadily when settled and with the right offer. in a certain way they have to restart the digestive tract.
unfortunately a hillstream-design is not made to see much to jugde a specimen's body condition. you remember hypergastromyzon cf humilis I presented? not so eager at the food-search, I thought, that's perhaps species-like. didn't make it. that's hard to swallow.
last year I bought a few specimen with outstanding dorsal skeleton out of a LFS-tank to try it. all died (1 exeption).
just two examples. guess which one survived ...
all started to eat. I won't repeat this for shure because even the best input can't save them
another problem is the offer itself: dry food, which contains ordinary mammal meat is not the right thing. I heard some pellets have the same effect. it's turned to grease and burdens the liver. a long life is not to be expected, nor breeding.
Jim, you are certainly doing it the right way. what about some more details on the complete keeping complex? I'm shure after 7 years of keeping a certain specimen you have a lot to report?
cheers charles
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Jim Powers
- Posts: 5208
- Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:15 pm
- Location: Bloomington, Indiana
Basically, I just provide the fish with clean, well oxygenated water in the 24-26C range (75-79F). I try to get the temperature a bit lower if I can but it stays at 24C (75F) mostly. I also have UV sterilizers on two hillstream tanks.
I feed the fish a variety of foods but tend to avoid foods with lots of processed wheat flour and things like that. Omega One, Ultracolor, and New Life Spectrum are the most used. Hikari frozen bloodworms and spirulina brine shrimp are also offered regularly. In one tank, I used Tetra Delica gel food to entice the ocellatus in the #1 pic of mine, to eat again after it stopped eating. Since then, that tank gets some of that food, but I am about to run out and it is no longer carried in the US. In the same tank, I also have some old homalopteras that are probably 6-7 years old.
The same food, except for the Tetra Delica, is fed to hillstreams in my original river tank. I have some old hillstreams in that tank too. There is a beaufortia and sinogastromyzon wui that were about 2.5" (6cm) when I got them over 8 years ago so who knows how old they actually are. They could be 9-10 years old or older. I really don't think I have done anything special. I think it helps to start with fish that are in good condition. There are probably some others on this site that also have some hillstreams that are getting old.
I feed the fish a variety of foods but tend to avoid foods with lots of processed wheat flour and things like that. Omega One, Ultracolor, and New Life Spectrum are the most used. Hikari frozen bloodworms and spirulina brine shrimp are also offered regularly. In one tank, I used Tetra Delica gel food to entice the ocellatus in the #1 pic of mine, to eat again after it stopped eating. Since then, that tank gets some of that food, but I am about to run out and it is no longer carried in the US. In the same tank, I also have some old homalopteras that are probably 6-7 years old.
The same food, except for the Tetra Delica, is fed to hillstreams in my original river tank. I have some old hillstreams in that tank too. There is a beaufortia and sinogastromyzon wui that were about 2.5" (6cm) when I got them over 8 years ago so who knows how old they actually are. They could be 9-10 years old or older. I really don't think I have done anything special. I think it helps to start with fish that are in good condition. There are probably some others on this site that also have some hillstreams that are getting old.
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Jim Powers
- Posts: 5208
- Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:15 pm
- Location: Bloomington, Indiana
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Francois van Brederode
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- Location: Alkmaar (North Holland)
Jim, you are great!
My record of the long-term breeding is 7 years and half.
Only one Black Kuhli has lived.
Stiphodon gobies are comparatively longevity with my water tank.
There is sometimes the individual living more than 5 years.
However, the Gastromyzon genus is short-lived in my breeding environment.
The following is good case.
Zebrinus has a long duration of survival most, and it is 4 years from 3.
The next is duration of survival of 3 years from 2 in ctenocephalus.
ocellatus was the shortest, and to be the longest was 1 year and half.
I think that it is zebrinus to be the poorest at low water temperature.
Only zebrinus has developed white dot disease when I put it at water temperature less than 23 degrees Celsius by my mistake for one week.
For my impression, the tendency to like bloodwarm is a turn of zebrinus> ocelatus> ctenocephalus.
But there is the individual which comes to eat food except the algae, and there is the individual which only algae eats throughout the life.
Their preference is various every individual so that the patterns of their design are various.
I perform strong long time illumination and eutrophication of the water to multiply algae.
Furthermore, I examine the additive to increase algae.
The picture is the example.
I added manure for various gardening in the water of the water tank and I exposed it to light of the sun and compared quantity of increase of the algae.
The video of the feeding scenery of the blood worm is uploaded, too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-FL0q43SXU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oM-2AVVVDwU
Gastromyzon, Pseudogastromyzon, Hypergastromyzon and stiphodon et al. eat a blood worm.
The pipette which bent a point works well.
An impression of the teeth on the algae-covered glass by Gastromyzon.
An impression of the teeth on the algae-covered glass by snail.
My record of the long-term breeding is 7 years and half.
Only one Black Kuhli has lived.
Stiphodon gobies are comparatively longevity with my water tank.
There is sometimes the individual living more than 5 years.
However, the Gastromyzon genus is short-lived in my breeding environment.
The following is good case.
Zebrinus has a long duration of survival most, and it is 4 years from 3.
The next is duration of survival of 3 years from 2 in ctenocephalus.
ocellatus was the shortest, and to be the longest was 1 year and half.
I think that it is zebrinus to be the poorest at low water temperature.
Only zebrinus has developed white dot disease when I put it at water temperature less than 23 degrees Celsius by my mistake for one week.
For my impression, the tendency to like bloodwarm is a turn of zebrinus> ocelatus> ctenocephalus.
But there is the individual which comes to eat food except the algae, and there is the individual which only algae eats throughout the life.
Their preference is various every individual so that the patterns of their design are various.
I perform strong long time illumination and eutrophication of the water to multiply algae.
Furthermore, I examine the additive to increase algae.
The picture is the example.
I added manure for various gardening in the water of the water tank and I exposed it to light of the sun and compared quantity of increase of the algae.
The video of the feeding scenery of the blood worm is uploaded, too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-FL0q43SXU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oM-2AVVVDwU
Gastromyzon, Pseudogastromyzon, Hypergastromyzon and stiphodon et al. eat a blood worm.
The pipette which bent a point works well.
An impression of the teeth on the algae-covered glass by Gastromyzon.
An impression of the teeth on the algae-covered glass by snail.
I am not used to English. Therefore,It is likely to sometimes misunderstand it.
good morning
I agree with odyssey: you are great.
I have some pictures with algae covered glasses in a ocellatus/stellauts and a lineolata tank. later if needed.
last week I was asking in the trade about UV-systems for my new installation, because I can see a certain potential there. after all hillies live in very clean rivers. even if they learn to handle bacterial charge it won't prolong their lifespan. I think to invest some swiss francs there.
cheers charles
edit: just had a look at the videos. really fun to see. In case I'd to gain spectators/sponsors I would copy your method if you don't mind. but it's not your "everyday bloodworm show" is it?
with some hundreds of different fish that would cover a wholeday's entertainment.
I agree with odyssey: you are great.
I have some pictures with algae covered glasses in a ocellatus/stellauts and a lineolata tank. later if needed.
last week I was asking in the trade about UV-systems for my new installation, because I can see a certain potential there. after all hillies live in very clean rivers. even if they learn to handle bacterial charge it won't prolong their lifespan. I think to invest some swiss francs there.
cheers charles
edit: just had a look at the videos. really fun to see. In case I'd to gain spectators/sponsors I would copy your method if you don't mind. but it's not your "everyday bloodworm show" is it?
with some hundreds of different fish that would cover a wholeday's entertainment.
Last edited by ch.koenig on Mon Sep 21, 2009 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jim Powers
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- Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 6:15 pm
- Location: Bloomington, Indiana
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