SKINNY DISEASE

[mikev]

Fish reaction seems unusual -- I saw or heard very little about fish reacting to it, other than appetite changes. I tried to find anything googling for "cichlids levamisole" and nothing came up, this seems strange. I never heard about its impact on plants, but perhaps it is true and nobody paid attention.

One possibility that comes to mind: possibly the sunshine disabled the med and perhaps broke it quickly, the breakdown stuff is what affected the cichlids. Notice that levamisole does break down under light, and you had good tropical sun on it. Another possibility is that something was wrong with the med.

If your clowns are really in as bad a shape as the photo, perhaps it would make sense to do another try, using a brand used by someone else, and at least protecting the tank from the sun (or putting the med into the tank at sundown). The other possibility is to try prazi (tapeworm-effective, roundworm--not effective).

[andyroo]

Mike,
They're not in bad shape, they're just on the slim side when compared to many of the photos on this site, and don't grow as quickly as some would suggest they should. The Lev. i used is the only availible on-island without a sugar syrup to make your dog like it.
I'll try again after sundown in the next couple of days. Are there guidelines for soaking food-bits in Lev.? Is there possiblity of overmedicating doing this? Considering the cichlid and plant/algae/aestheitc recations i'd prefer to try a more targetted approach (soaked food) if i can.
A

[mikev]

Andy,

Levamisole delivered in food seems to be not very efficient, perhaps not at all efficient. UltraCarePX that I used originally may be the best thing to try.
The old post is here.

You can soak any dry food (flakes, dry worms, pellets) in it, and give it to the fish for a few days. It mostly worked for me, with two exceptions, both solved by followup levamisole: one was a fish that did not actively feed (kubotai), this was obvious; the other was a slim (not skinny) clown who did feed fine, so I don't know for sure why prazi failed (guessing a roundworm involvement).

hth

[Martin Thoene]

Mike,
First Lev treatment was according to dosages recommeded on this site. Don't remember the percentages. Bought it from the local farm store.
The stuff turned the water bright yellow and was not mest with a pleased reaction from cichlids (heavy breathing, clamped fins), though nobody else seemed to notice. The stuff stayed without filtration (just bubbler) for 5 days. Good sunshine etc... and i could see cichlids getting better so didn't fuss water changes too much. After 5 days topped up water (20% or so) and put new charcoal in filter.

Didn't see much growth in fish, but plants exploded ! Levamisol is or breakes down into some serious fertilizer.

I'm thinking of re-treating after the Ich season (cold snapps in January).

A

andyroo, I asked Dr. Momfish about this. She said that possibly you had used the solid form of Levamisole, is that correct?
The tablet form's drug carrier contains a lot of cellulose and this will break down and form perfect fertilizer, so no wonder the plants thrived.
Had you done a serious water-change instead of topping up, this would not have happened.

Martin.

[andyroo]

Thanks Martin,
Nope- it was a liquid form, but it may have been made out of the solid.
I agree that the top-up wasn't the best bet, but it didn't seem to be affecting anybody negatively after a day or two so i let it run its course. It was also the only bottle of pure (non-sugared) Lev. in town, so i needed to treat less water/run the water down to be sure i'd have enough med.
A

[Hell Fire]

I didnt get any decent pics unfortunatly but did treat with a internal bac medication which had no results what so ever! then a fishy forum friend on another site said he sold this stuff called FLUBENOL 15. He actually gave me some free and wow within a few days he was putting on wieght and within a week as fat as ever and now after only a few wees since the dose hes caught up and is as big as the others!!!

[Patti-Mc]

Hi there everyone. I was looking around this forum and I thought I should weigh in on this "skinny" disease topic. About 30 years ago I found what seemed to be a miracle cure for this condition - epsom salts. I don't know why it worked, I only know that it did! Here is what happened:

I had been keeping fish for about 2-3 months, and when I saw some baby clown loaches at the fish store, I fell in love with them! I think I bought about 3 or 4 of them. After a couple of weeks I noticed that one was not doing nearly as well as the other three. It was eating, but getting thinner by the day. This went on for a while - maybe a month. The poor fish got so weak that I actually held it in my hand just under the water surface and put the brine shrimp right in front of it so it could eat. It was as skinny as any of the pictures that you all are showing.

My mother had kept fish since she was a little girl so she knew a lot about it. I told her about my poor little clown. Then she said (I'll never forget this) You ARE putting the epsom salts in the water aren't you? I said no, just the de-chlorinator and the aquarium salt. She said to put in Epsom salt at the rate of 1 tsp. per 5 gallons, so of course I did, not necessarily because I thought it would cure my clown, but just because she said to.

The next 10 days were an unbelievable experience. That little clown started to gain weight, began to join in with the others, got all energetic, and honestly, in 10 days he looked just like the others! They all went on to grow big and lived for a long time.

This is my story and if I hadn't seen it all with my own eyes I might not believe it. I have told a few different people about it at the fish stores and nobody really takes me seriously. The only response I ever got that showed that the guy believed me was "maybe the Epsom salt acted as a laxative (one of its qualities) and the fished passed the internal parasites."

That may be the explanation - I don't really know. But it would be worth a try if your fish is really going downhill. If this is helpful to anyone, let me know. I still love clown loaches (I have 6 right now) and I'd do just about anything to help clowns live successfully in everyone's aquariums.

[shari2]

Welcome Patti and thanks for sharing.

[chefkeith]

Adding epsom salt or salt might kill parasites through osmosis.

[fassed]

Hi,
I have been following the discussion. I notice that my 3 1/2 clown I think has CWS.
I have only had him for about a month. A week half ago a notice him getting skinny. I know have him in a small tank by himself. He eating like a big. He is very active. I wonder sometimes if he lost weight do to all the new home adjustments. He never did eat as well as the others.
I guess my guestions are;
1) Do they eat so well with CWS?


2)My LFS store said he would take him back for another larger one,but not as much color should I?

3) Has anybody any luck with Jungle Internal Parasite Guard? I could only find the food Pepso loacally. I know giving that. I see Big Als as the guard.

Thanks guys and girls

[peacefulfishie]

I also want to know if they have CWS do they still eat? And is the Parasite Guard Tank Buddies and safe product to use with the loaches?

I have 1 small clown loach that is looking like it has CWS, and swimming oddly. I also have a few tetras that are wasting away. It seems to be easier to see it with them because they are small anyway.

A friend of mine fed a bunch of BBS Levamisole, and said to feed them that, but to get my FW shrimp out of there or they would die. Is that true? I don't want to risk their health, they are getting pretty big.

He swears that this has worked for him, and he is not the kind of guy that resorts to chemicals often.

[TammyLiz]

The parasite clear would help if your fish have flukes or the like, but the ingredients listed are ineffective against roundworms, which from what I have gathered, are usually the culprit behind "skinny". If you can easily get some levimasole, go with that! It is effective against roundworms/nematodes. The shrimp would be an issue because it attacks inverts, which is why it kills the roundworms.

Speaking of roundworms/nematodes, I have them in my tank. I have a yoyo that I've been thinking would fall under the category of having skinny disease. The other day I actually saw what looked to be a nematode in the mouth of my pleco as he sucked the front glass. Its a rubbernose pleco, so his mouth is huge, and I can see the inner lining of his mouth (what I would describe as his cheek) as he sucks on the glass. The nematode was squirming around inside the tissue of his cheek. So uhm, I guess I'm going to be forking out the $25 or $30 for the levamisole to be delivered to my house. I've called vets and farm supply stores and none of them sell it around here, and vets won't treat fish. I will share my complete story for the yoyo once treatment is done, shari.

EDIT: Also to add for the two posters above, my skinny yoyo doesn't really eat as much as the others. I think he is weak enough that he is unable to compete for food at this point. Originally he ate fine, but lately has not been. Same with a gourami that began to waste away in the same tank, although she has been removed to her own tank since she was being picked on by other gouramis. Even now in the calmer/smaller tank she eats very slowly, and the neons I have in there for company for her almost out-compete her for food so sometimes I literally hang bloodworms into the tank and feed them to her by hand (which she loves). I do suspect that both the gourami and the yoyo have nematodes, and probably a more advanced case than the pleco, even though I actually saw it in the pleco. I look forward to seeing how the levamisole treatment goes and I'm relieved that I have an excellent excuse to buy it!

[peacefulfishie]

Well, I have been researching like crazy to find out if levamisole IS toxic to FW shrimp, and from what I can find is that is is toxic to terrestrial invertebrates.

I sure wish Shari would pitch in here - she said it was safe for the shrimp. Maybe I'll PM her.

TammyLiz - Congratulations on the baby! How exciting!

[TammyLiz]

Well, I have been researching like crazy to find out if levamisole IS toxic to FW shrimp, and from what I can find is that is is toxic to terrestrial invertebrates.

I sure wish Shari would pitch in here - she said it was safe for the shrimp. Maybe I'll PM her.

TammyLiz - Congratulations on the baby! How exciting!

Thanks! In one sense I can't wait for baby to come, and in another, I'm glad we have another month to prepare before he comes!

I'm interested to know about the shrimp, too.

I have read that it also kills snails which can pollute a tank if there are too many of them. I was a little worried about that, considering one of the tanks I'd be treating is heavily infested with them.

[mikev]

The parasite clear would help if your fish have flukes or the like, but the ingredients listed are ineffective against roundworms, which from what I have gathered, are usually the culprit behind "skinny".

Tapeworms. Some indirect roundworms very likely are involved too, but the most common roundworms are nematodes.

I don't fully understand the situation in your tank and never heard of nematodes seen in the mouth,..but do get levamisole asap, if you are correct on nematodes, it is not something that gives you much time to spare. You may easily have more than one type of worms involved. Good luck!