Help my kids are sick!

[sweetlilbully]

Hi everyone!
I just found this site because I was googling ick and velvet issues with loaches. How can I tell what my guys have? I had 4 loaches, one just died, and the other 3 are sick. I normally have a well conditioned tank with light aqarium salt (about 1tbsp/10 gal) at 78 degrees with an airstone. I have a large pleco, couple dwarf gouramis, couple coreys, and my loaches. I just got back from a weekend away, and my loaches were spotty, one looking beyond help (the drifty type) and he died last night. I did a major water change (about 40%), removed my carbon, gave a 75% coppersafe dose, and I'm typing in the dark trying the darkness thing (how does that work anyway?). I'm scared to raise my temp because of my pleco, scared to full dose the copper because of other threads, scared to add extra salt because of other threads, and scared to do nothing because I don't want to lose my babies. How can I tell the difference between ick, velvet, and parasites? At first I thought they had ick, but looking at the coppersafe bottle, the example picture for velvet looks like what my guys have, but the description of the parasites (mucousy, rapid breathing, etc.) sounds like them too. Ahhh, I need help! If anyone could explain this stuff to me I would be soo greatful. I'm afraid that it may even be too late for these guys, the stuff seems to be getting more intense over the last 2 days.

Thanks,
Kari

[wolfeyed]

If it is Ich, they will look like someone rolled them in sugar (unless they only have a few spots, but you get the point). Ich is small qhote spots....really small. And yes, they would also have difficulty breathing as the Ich parasites invade their gills. You have the best chance of treating Ich if you read up on it's lifecycle. Treat with a 1/2 strength dose of Ich cure or a full dose of Ich Cure II by Jungle (it's for scaleless fish). You can try raising the tempurature to speed up the Ich's life cycle and wrap all 4 side of the tank glass with newspaper or blankets so that NO light can get it (and NO peeking!) for 72 hrs. Supposedly this will kill the ich cause they can't find the fish without the light and they starve to death.

Velvet looks like a grayish slime and covers the fish. They make a second treatment for that.

With both of these, have an antibiotic on standby and watch for signs of secondary infections.

Make sure to remove your carbon when medicating, and do water changes as directed.

[starsplitter7]

Hi Kari,

Welcome. I am very sorry, you come to this site under difficult circumstances, but hopefully someone will be able to help you. I am relatively new, so I do not have the expertise of some on this site, but I can get you started.

Ick looks like your fish have been sprinkled with salt.

Velvet looks like they have a gold sheen. Easier to see if you use a flashlight.

Why not post a few pictures? It may help people to help you.

Tell us about your tank? How big, how long have the fish been in there? What kind of Pleco do you have? How big? How long have you had it?

What decorations do you have? Do all fish have shelters?

When I treat my tank it goes up to 86 and that's with a Pleco. They all do fine as long as you increase the oxygen.

To increase your oxygen, drop you water level by an inch or two, so the water has to fall. I would definitely do that no matter what is wrong with your fish, because it will decrease their stress. I think one reason for the darkness is to reduce stress.

You'll find on this site most people recommend against using salt, except for treatment, in Loach and Cory tanks, since these fish do not tolerate salt well.

Good Luck. Tanja.

[chefkeith]

Be very carefull about adding antibiotics in combination with Coppersafe. Antibiotics like Triple Sulfa or Neomycine will make the copper toxic and kill the fish.

The treatment for ich and velvet is basically the same. Coppersafe and/or salt will kill both. It just takes time to kill them off, usually 1-2 weeks for a full recovery.

Most fish tolerate salt, but loaches and other sensitive fish do not tolerate the change of salt content to well for osmolarity reasons. If you increase the salt level do it slowly, like over the coarse of a few days. If you decrease the salt level do it very very very slowly, like over the course of a few weeks.

The ich/velvet treatment dosage for salt is 2 teaspoons of salt per gallon of water.

[sweetlilbully]

Thanks everyone for all of your help. I did another water change today to remove some of the copper...everyone was scaring me and i threw in some parasite clear from jungle because it said it treats internal parasites too...i was looking at the parasite food meds, but since my guys wont eat, I decided not to waste my money on that. I've stared at my fish for hours in the last couple of days, and I think my pleco has a gold tail, hes a normal boring black one about 10 inches...is that velvet or is that normal? he still eats normal (2 small waffers a day) and poops like crazy, but i think my loaches have the ick. Still not sure, the spots are super tiny and EVERYWHERE unlike the sugar/salt crystal examples. Another one started drifting tonight so I'm scared that I caught it too late. I've successfully treated ick a couple years back, but it wasnt this bad. My drifty guy is starting to look like his skin is peeling off and his fins are turning pale its sooo sad...is that still ick? or death?

Kari

[chefkeith]

Like I said, you need to be careful when changing out salted water. Sick or weaked fish absolutely do not respond well to osmotic changes, especially drops in salinity or TDS. One of the saddest symptoms of osmotic shock is the lose of fins and scales.