Please identify my loaches

[angelfish83]

I think its a burmese lace loach. I have two. They stopped growing at about two inches. I have had them for about 9 months...


Thanks

[Martin Thoene]

Botia kubotai. They were called "Angelicus Botia" for a while, Burmese Border Loaches is another "common" name.

Martin.

[angelfish83]

Its definitely not a kubotai. It is full grown. I know what Kubotais look like. The guy who sold them to me thought they were young kubotai but nope.

Here is a very emaciated lace loach


what do you think???

Thanks though

[Graeme Robson]

And they haven't stopped growing. 9 months from lfs is just teen-age stages.

[Mark in Vancouver]

Botia kubotai, IMO. 2 inches is not full grown for any Botia species that I know of. Y. sidthimunki, perhaps, but yours is clearly not a sid.

Mr. Thoene is something of an expert on loaches, you know. And many - lots - of us on this forum keep these fish. It's a kubotai. "Burmese lace loach" would be a very sensible common name for kubotai. Unfortunately, there seem to be more common names than there are loaches, so they mean very little.

[angelfish83]

Well both my loaches are identical and I have seen kubotai for sale at half the size and they look nothing like this

[Graeme Robson]

Awwrr! I remember December 2002.



And in February 2003 i posted some pictures. http://www.loaches.com/species_pages/bo ... anmar.html

[kimby]

angel fish have you looked at the pictures of kubotai in the species index on the main page? www.loaches.com

there can actually be a wide variation in their markings.
They'll probably change too as they grow.

[angelfish83]

I appologize for my ignorance... After looking at those photos I think theres a good chance its kubotai-

but why are both identically (like DEAD ON) patterned in this way and not standard kubotai?

And at no point did i mean to imply that anyone was not an expert- I have actually heard about Mr Thoene before.


Cheers and thanks


Any advice on their care now that we kinda know what they are?

And why have they stopped growing at two inches? (for about five months now)

[mikev]

but why are both identically (like DEAD ON) patterned in this way and not standard kubotai?

Maybe because they came from the same river. Some variations are geographical (not that anyone really researched them for kubotai's)

And why have they stopped growing at two inches? (for about five months now)

They did not, they just slowed down. Kubotai's are not very fast growing comparing, for example, with yoyo's, so that the growth is hard to observe; and, just like other botias they grow faster initially but then slow down to a crawl. 2" is about the size where the growth becomes not noticeable, but it continues (unless there is something really wrong with the conditions OR they have worms). I _think_ it will take about two years to make another inch.

One obvious thing you can do for them is to get a couple more at least; generally peaceful botia species should be kept at 5+.

Incidentally, there are many names for Kubotai's out there. lace loach is a new for me.... but I saw them sold as Burmese Border Loach, Marble Loach and Leopard Loach. The most common trade name is Polka-Dot.

hth

[Mark in Vancouver]

These loaches can be posers for the best of us, particularly when they are bought at a young age. B. kubotai, B. histrionica, and B. rostrata can all look remarkably similar when they're young. The black vertical bars on kubotai tend to become more contrasted with the silver/yellow spots. Some fish show solid silver dots for years, or get them later in life.

To my knowledge, almost all of the kubotais that we see come from two major river drainages, but that is a gigantic area and Mikev may be right that loaches that appear in the same North American fish bag probably came from exactly the same place in the river system.

These are the perfect Botia to keep. They don't get enormous like clowns, and they thrive in a constant tank. Don't move stuff around, and don't mix them with really aggressive fish. Aim for the water parameters advised for any clown loach - softish water just south of 7 pH, a little on the acid side. Good circulation of the water helps. Keep them at 80F or just under. Provide ample hiding spots - things that they can go beneath to hide in darkness. A lot of people use plant pots, but I'm more fond of flat pieces of wood. The loaches seem to like resting with their heads jammed into a very dark spot.

Be very careful when you lift decor out of your tank for this reason.

They love food, so don't worry, but try to mix it up. Flake, bloodworm, brine shrimp, algae wafers, and possibly vegetables. I personally believe that their markings are affected by a high-carotene diet, so brine shrimp are a good bet.

Never mix salt in your kubotai tank for any reason. Dechlorinate water before it enters the tank. You should be good for years.

[Martin Thoene]

I've had 3 kubotai for nearly 3 years now in nothing smaller than a 120 gallon tank and they just stopped growing at about 2.5". All the 3 have different markings.









As you can see....a lot of variation, plus there are those with less markings (like yours) and also much more black with more bluish, small dots within the black areas.

Martin.

[angelfish83]

Thank you all for your help- you've all been much more helpful than any other forum Ive been to.

I would love to get them a bunch of friends- as mentioned. Unfortunately I don't know where to get them

I hope someone here can help me. I'd like to get about four or five B. histrionica but I can't find them anywhere. I thought that's what these were when I bought them. A friend has a histrionica and it's about four inches (it grew surprisingly fast) and its just a beautiful animal.

Can anyone tell me where to get these? Or does anyone have some they'd like to sell?

Im in the East York area but I'd be willing to travel quite far to get some good ones. This is my favourite kind of loach *after clowns* and I'd really love to get more of them.

Oh my water parameters are pH 6.8-7 gH 5-6 kH 5-6 Conductivity 350-400

Thanks

Oh and Ive got 2 angels 3 bolivian rams 20 or so amano shrimp, 9 bleedingheart tetras, the loaches, a pair of bristlenose pleco, and its a 55G (48x13x18*?)

thanks

--and its not sand (i know loaches prefer sand...) its just the standard size gravel (like what your Kubotais have Martin)

Thanks again everyone

[QueenDustBunny]

Thank you for your pictures. I thought that I was overfeeding mine and the large stomach was the result. I have 2 like that and 1 thinner one. I just love these little guys, might have to get a few more. (I originally got them at Petsmart, but will order them from the non-LFS, much better price and quality).

I never knew I had to remineralize RO water. I use well water and with all the junk in the orchard, I'm not putting it into my tank. Thanks for the tip.

I didn't mean to hijack your thread, please excuse the interruption.

Active tank
4 Long-fin Rosey Barbs
3 B. Kubotai
3 Bala Shark
1 Rainbow Shark

Community tank
6 Rummynose Tetras

[angelfish83]

Its ok im surprised nobody jacked it sooner Ill repost my current Q...