Opp's Help:*(

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Leeswede
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Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:35 am

Opp's Help:*(

Post by Leeswede » Tue Jan 25, 2011 8:07 am

I have two Chromobotia (Botia) macracantha and one Balantiocheilos melanopterus, 7 Paracheirodon innesi in a 2foot tank.
I change half the water and clean the filter in the old water etc..Every month. My problem is# the silver Shark is good freinds with the above, but very hungry and greedy and one off my Clowns is showing signs off very high stress and looks like he might die :(

So i have i have looked and found you lot! And too my shock i have found out that i should not have the Clowns in my tank.
They are my best fish and favourite, so to lose them would not be good.
I have taken the shark out and will take him back to the shop. And all so have fresh treated water waiting to go in. I have all so taking out the sick Clown as i think there is too much pee in the water from maybe over feeding from me as the shark is aways hungry and begging for food :roll:

Have i done right and can i keep Chromobotia (Botia) macracantha?
Thanks for your Help
Lee

starsplitter7
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Location: Tampa, Florida

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by starsplitter7 » Tue Jan 25, 2011 8:49 am

HI there,

You can keep the Clowns, but you would need a much larger tank 55 gallons for small ones, 120 or more for large ones. Some of my tanks are a bit overstocked adnd I do 1/4-1/2 water changes about every week, two at the most. The clowns need to be in a group of 5 or more, will grow to 12" or more and live 20+ years. They are awesome fish.

Unfortunately, over-feeding is the easiest way to kill fish. Look at the size of the eye on your fish, and that's about the size of the stomach. You don't want to feed much more than that a day, so you don't spoil the water. In a tank with a messy eater, sometimes it is a good idea to have a trio or more Cories. They are great at clean up, but don't forget to feed them too.

Good luck to you and your fish.

Leeswede
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:35 am

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Leeswede » Tue Jan 25, 2011 10:58 am

Hi Thanks for your help. But so many water change's? Wow that a lot. I just do it once a month.
Ive taken back the shark now and just hope the other clown lives? And now i have to make a choice to get a bigger tank and have the fish i love or stick with the 30 x 60inch and Neons and a plec ? I will have to think about this and save some pennys:)

Thanks again for your support and good luck to you

Lambi
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Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:31 pm

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Lambi » Tue Jan 25, 2011 12:29 pm

Il be the first to admit I'm no expert, but once a month certainly is not enough. I do a good 50% every week. Don't get me wrong I used to do them every 3 weeks but I paid the price, as did my poor fish. I have come to the conclusion that to have a happy,healthy aquarium it's one hundred percent effort or you may as well not bother. I only have the one tank, but that certainly keeps me busy enough, I don't quite know how some of these lot maintain multiple tanks and species ha :D Maybe one day I will be able to do the same, but for now ones enough! I get so much enjoyment from my tank these days it's crazy, seeing them little loaches thrive makes me happy :D

Whatever you do, do the best for your fish :D

starsplitter7
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Location: Tampa, Florida

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by starsplitter7 » Tue Jan 25, 2011 9:06 pm

I think of the tank as a toilet. Do I flush it once a week or once a month?

If you want to do fewer water changes, get very few , small fish (like 5-10 Neons and cardinals, lots of plants (no pleco -- unless it is a tiny one for that small tank -- my common plecos are 12"). Get three Cories and a snail (for algae -- if you have it).

Big fish produce lots of waste and need frequent water changes.

Leeswede
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Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:35 am

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Leeswede » Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:45 am

Cheers Guys, its relay made me think about what am i doing with these fish? I have to start again and think do i want the comment? and i take my hat off to you guys for yours :wink:
I will keep you updated on my fish and the new 35x90 tank that i am now looking at buying.

Lambi
Posts: 29
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:31 pm

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Lambi » Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:50 am

Leeswede wrote:Cheers Guys, its relay made me think about what am i doing with these fish? I have to start again and think do i want the comment? and i take my hat off to you guys for yours :wink:
I will keep you updated on my fish and the new 35x90 tank that i am now looking at buying.

Lol,put your hat back on and get that tank :)
Good luck and best wishes.

Leeswede
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:35 am

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Leeswede » Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:53 am

starsplitter7 wrote:I think of the tank as a toilet. Do I flush it once a week or once a month?

If you want to do fewer water changes, get very few , small fish (like 5-10 Neons and cardinals, lots of plants (no pleco -- unless it is a tiny one for that small tank -- my common plecos are 12"). Get three Cories and a snail (for algae -- if you have it).
Big fish produce lots of waste and need frequent water changes.
I have small fish[ 2Clowns are not 2incs and the plec is 2inc and a bit and 6neons and 1 Torpedo tetra.So do i have to clean every week? Thanks

starsplitter7
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Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by starsplitter7 » Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:01 am

I do. You don't want to stunt them, and smaller fish need more food which really pollutes the tank -- Not just with fish waste, but also with food waste. You never want to overfeed, because it spoils the water. The cleaner the water, the healthier the fish.

I have two small tanks. One is a nursery tank for baby fish and one is a quarantine tank. I change 50% of the water every other day, and sometimes more often, if the water is dirty. The fish in these tanks are tiny. The tanks are heavily planted.

If you didn't have the clowns, I would consider less water changes, but with the clowns, I wouldn't dream of it. They will stunt in such a small tank.

Sorceress
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Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Sorceress » Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:49 pm

just had to jump in when i saw this post yes get a bigger tank the clowns need it but on the water changes i also have an over stocked tank and do a once a month change and my fish are doing great tho i got one thing going for me i got one sponge filter for up to a ten gallon tank a box filter for a five gallon tank and a filter for a three gallon plus two java plants and a moss ball

for the box filter i use a carbon and floss mix and for the 3 gallon plex stick on the wall filter it uses a carbon/ammonia mix rock in it and my water is clear as a bell and only feed when they are near the feeding ring and only what they need is how i get away from the frequent water changes but if you want to feed more you will have to do frequent water changes and that is my humble opinion on the matter

starsplitter7
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Location: Tampa, Florida

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by starsplitter7 » Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:52 pm

I agree, the more filters you use, the better off your fish. I have 2-3 filters on everytank, plus sponge filters and bubblers. I still do lots of water changes, but my tanks are overstocked. Small tanks will stunt fish. Although some people consider this a plus, it actually can cause bone and organ damage. The bigger your tanks, the less errors will affect your fish and less frequent water changes. The more frequent the water changes, the less likely you will shock your fish with a big change of chemistry in your tank.

I always have 0 Ammonia and Nitrite, but I keep an eye on the Nitrates, because they sneak up.

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Keith Wolcott
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Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Keith Wolcott » Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:20 pm

More filters are of course a good thing, but do nothing to reduce nitrate levels. Keeping the nitrate level less than 20 ppm is a good idea. If you don't know the nitrate level of your tank it would be wise to obtain a test kit and regularly monitor it. There are several factors, such as tank load and plant growth, that affect the nitrate level, but a typical tank requires around a 50% water change every week to keep the nitrate level below 20 ppm. The only way to really know is to regularly test your water.

Sorceress
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Location: W. Washington State

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Sorceress » Fri Jan 28, 2011 3:01 am

true keith i agree with that but i have had my tank over a year set up like this no problems whatsoever and the fish are happy campers up until a few months ago when i noticed the betta at lights out was harassing the white clouds so will be getting a bigger tank and i will also be getting a nitrate test kit at your suggestion as i have never monitored that due to the fish have been happy with the 50% change when i change out the carbon and floss on the box and pull the cartridge out of the plex filter once a month

Leeswede
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Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 7:35 am

Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Leeswede » Fri Jan 28, 2011 3:59 am

Thanks for your help 8) I have been bugging my Girlfriend about this and asking her is it all right to get a bigger tank? And she likes the small one. So i might have to agree with her as i have been down this road before. About 10years ago a had a very big tank and a lot off sharks and silver dollars and clowns. But i could not put the time in as work was too much for me and smoking things i should off not :wink: Made me lazy. Im 37 now so maybe i can do it better this time. I would like a 90x35 size tank with a sand base and lots of plants and stone and Bog wood, 5Clowns 2Plecs 7Neons and 4other Loaches. And 50% water changes every week.
Would this work?
Cheers

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Keith Wolcott
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Re: Opp's Help:*(

Post by Keith Wolcott » Sat Jan 29, 2011 7:46 am

Sorceress- Even a year with happy healthy fish is no guarantee that you are not headed for trouble. The nitrate level can very slowly increase and the fish will adapt to it as much as they can, but at some point it will become a problem. If your fish load is small and you have lots of plants, you might be fine.

If you are interested, here is some data. My tanks have about an average fish load and I find that this adds about 1 ppm per day of nitrate (from the food put in, which the fish eat, excrete as ammonia, which bacteria transform to nitrite, which bacteria transform to nitrate). Below, I did calculations (actually I just used the water change wizard that ChefKeith and I wrote) for fish loads of .5, 1, and 2 ppm per day of nitrate added. The first is a very low fish load and the last is quite high, but some people have such tanks. Now suppose the nitrate starts at 10 ppm and you do 50% water changes every month. Below is what happens over time in each case.

Case 1: A low fish load adds .5 ppm per day of nitrate.
At 1 month, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 14 ppm.
At 6 months, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 20 ppm.
At 1 year, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 20 ppm.
At 2 years, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 20 ppm.

Thus the nitrate plateaus at 20 ppm right after each water change. Just before each water change, it is 40 ppm.


Case 2: A medium fish load adds 1 ppm per day of nitrate.
At 1 month, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 23 ppm.
At 6 months, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 40 ppm.
At 1 year, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 41 ppm.
At 2 years, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 41 ppm.

Thus the nitrate stabilizes at 41 ppm right after each water change. Just before each water change, it is 82 ppm.


Case 3: A heavy fish load adds 2 ppm per day of nitrate.
At 1 month, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 41 ppm.
At 6 months, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 79 ppm.
At 1 year, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 82 ppm.
At 2 years, right after the water change, the nitrate will be at 82 ppm.

Thus the nitrate stabilizes at 82 ppm right after each water change. Just before each water change, it is 164 ppm.

I would consider that in all three cases, not only is the nitrate rather high, but also the water change is hard on the fish since it there is such a large change in the nitrate levels. Again, only a nitrate test kit can tell you what is really happening in your case.

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