Kuhli Loaches, what species?

[Loachloach]

Hi all,
One of my small tanks became empty due to moving the other fish to other tanks.
It's a 60x40x45(24"x16"x18"), around 30G tank.

I am thinking to get a group of some kuhli loaches but I am not certain what species there are available and which ones and how many can I fit inside the tank. Also, what temperature is best for them? I am not pushed about tankmates due to the size of the tank. Do they need dither fish?

The tank has been running for a long time(2-3 years) and has 2 cycled filters but I recently removed the media from the trickle filter and planted it with house plants in hydroton clay pebbles media. So it just has one cycled filter at the moment but I've been dosing with ammonia to boost the bacs back up. There are no fish in it at the moment.

I changed the substrate to play sand and only put it today so it's still a bit cloudy because of that. I will be adding manzanita branches and oak leaves once I get them in the next 2-3 weeks too.

Any suggestions and constructive critisism welcomed.

[Loachloach]

Well, apparently there isn't a great choice of species here.
I was able to find them in one place only and I ordered 7 "striped" ones labeled Pangio sp. So I'll have to see what arrives.
Thanks for your help guys and girls

[Loachloach]

Just two questions guys.

What temperature is best for kuhli loaches.
I read contradicting info, like they like lower tropical temperatures, between 70-75 and then on other places they recommend over 75.
Also, low flow like swamp conditions or higher flow?

[NancyD]

Pretty tank, loachloach! I kept my pangios at ~77F with HOB filters, not a lot of flow. They loved hanging out in plants even floating Indian fern almost out of the water. Maybe you could add some more plants for them otherwise they may hide in the coconut except at feeding. I'm not sure they "need" dither fish but a school of small fish would look good & help any kuhli shyness. Lots of choices, little pseudomugil rainbows or small rasboras come to mind.

[riz1983]

Same with me, I kept my pangios with werneri rainbows, pseudomugil furcatus, boraras merah, and the shy little hyalobagrus flavus catfish.

[Loachloach]

Thanks Nancy.

Thanks NancyD.

I am actually going to add manzanita sticks/wood once I receive it, and lots of oak leaves too.
I decided on a low tech, mostly unplanted tank as I am a bit tired of taking care of plants, hence I planted the trickle filter instead to still benefit from the good stuff plants do. But I did add a pot of hydrocolyte japan and I'll try floating plants too. Otherwise most won't grow in such a low stock tank.

Here it is at the moment:



And a dark video of the loaches just after I added them. I still have no idea what species they sent me, possibly P. semicincta or P. myersi, but they are too small for me to see.
I actually do have forktail rainbows in another tank, but they seem too happy there, maybe if I breed them I can move a few.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToHwgUuy_c0

[NancyD]

Those look like a similar species to what I had. I thought either semicinctus or kuhli but not myersi for yours & mine (I think in myersi dark bands goes all the way around the "tummy"). They look nice but could use some fattening up, how long would you say they are? I got a couple tiny ones, ~2cm, that didn't seem as robust as ones I got larger, maybe 5cm.

Have you kept threadfin rainbows? They're best in pairs, maybe 2 or 3. Cherry barbs? I had a male that was always really red & aggressive last time I had them but I think he was unusual, not like I'd had before. Espei rasboras?

How about a needle leaf java fern attached to your wood to lift the pangio's living area or a bigger crypt,( I have c. houdouri (?) that will be awesome in time? In a densely planted tank they were all over, with mostly crypts & valis, they were strictly bottom dwellers. Just a thought, I understand the planted tank maintenance issues, lol, my "fish friends" are really hard core plant people (right, Diana?). I'm sure your loaches will be happy, keep us posted.

[Loachloach]

Thanks again.

The kuhlis are very thin, malnourished looking if you ask me, especially some of them. They would be about 5cm long I think. I have 8 kuhlis(if they are all alive). They need fattening up but they aren't eating!! First time I get fish that aren't hungry when introduced. I hope they aren't sick. A few started playing after tank and room lights out. I had to stare at them almost in the dark.

There are 2 java ferns inside, very small. They've been in this tank for years and don't grow, keep dying. I've plenty of plants that I can put from my other tanks but in a non fertilized/low bioload tank they'll be struggling. I might just get more anubias. I've got the big variety of it, so it can cover half the tank once it grows. I planted an echinodorus in that pot between the pennywort, so if it grows, it will be large too.
But once I put the wood and leaves, they'll have plenty of places to hide for the time being and there are lots of holes in between the stones. I'll see how it goes and I can do changes if needs be.

Have you kept threadfin rainbows?

No, I haven't. I love rainbows. I have to look them up. Thanks.
I think I'll pass on the barbs. I like the espei rasboras. If the kuhlis decide they'll hide all the time, I'll consider some tiny fish.

But I actually just wanted to keep shrimp with the kuhlis as I have plenty of them and I don't want to introduce a predator. Plus I want to keep the tank just for the kuhlis fish wise, to give them a chance to come out more, unless they definately need dither fish.

[Loachloach]

Those look like a similar species to what I had. I thought either semicinctus or kuhli but not myersi for yours & mine (I think in myersi dark bands goes all the way around the "tummy").

I also read that semicinctus have black lips and the first couple of black bands on their heads go all the way round. But mine are so thin I can't see properly yet.

[NancyD]

Shrimp are good choice, I kept cherries with my kuhlis. They may have eaten some on the tiny ones, not that I minded a slower growing population. None of mine were fussy eaters but they were always spoiled for choices. The only special thing I did was shave frozen bloodworms into small bites, all the fish had small mouths. Hopefully yours will start eating once they adjust.

[Loachloach]

I dropped another type of food(NLS micro pellets) and some came out and were eating. Maybe they just need very small food...Then again, no one refuses these pellets and even my shrimp love them more than anything else, although they are a community fish formula.
I hope the kuhlis feel well and fatten up a bit.

Here is one putting up a show today:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu6EuGQ62Ag

[Loachloach]

I just added more decor to the kuhli loach tank so wanted to update with pictures.

The kuhlis seem ok and I see a few sifting through the sand from time to time so hopefully they'll be ok.

[NancyD]

Looks even better! Glad they're eating, how often do you feed?

[Loachloach]

Thanks Nancy. They fairly enjoy these leaves. Pity I can't take a proper video but they all went into the leaves and started munching around the place. The ones that I was able to see properly since I got them, look fine, at least externally so I hope they don't have any diseases. The reason I am afraid is that the shop sent me these the same day they received them, so they went through double shipping and possibly no major quarantine. I did acclimate for 2.5 hrs as they came from very soft water too.

For feeding I tried twice a day in the beginning, but they weren't handling it, or didn't like the food. Then I moved some shrimp to the tank so I can use them as a clean up crew and indicator of the water quality just in case.
The NLS micro pellets were more readily accepted by the kuhlis. They didn't even like the blood worms prior to that.
Now, I'll stick to feeding them once a day after lights off and observe. I know they are babies, so they'll need regular feeding, possibly twice is better but I have to be careful with left over food. I am used of having pigs instead of fish, so not used of fish not eating fast

[Loachloach]

Loaching in their new home

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUjATAS9TVA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgc3QDGOmlM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RJbBbayMeE