Stocking 125G with Clowns

[Nick Hancock]

I recently purchased four clown loaches (appx 2.5-3in) who are currently being housed with my Sewellia. I'm soon setting up a 125G which will be their home, to which I'll add a few more clowns as I know more is better. The store I purchased them from was down to four, so I took them.

Does anyone have stocking suggestions or warnings?

I'll likely put a group of Sewellia in there, as I just watched one gliding back and forth with a couple of the clowns as I type this. I've observed them occasionally free-swimming slowly at mid-level since I put the clowns in. Very cool behavior that I had not seen prior to adding the clowns.

[redshark1]

Hi. Well, the first thing that comes to mind is the incompatible temperature ranges of the fish you mention.

Clown Loach behaviour and health seems, from my own observations, to be promoted by a minimum temperature of 80F.

I don't keep Sewellia but believe they are usually kept well below that.

I'd also recommend to others reading this to purchase the whole Clown Loach shoal together as a group. Adding fish later starts the whole White Spot outbreak over again (they tend to get it when newly introduced). You don't want that if you can help it.

[Nick Hancock]

The upper end of the Sewellia temp range is about the bottom end of the clown loach temp range wherever I've looked, and I've always kept Sewellia around room temp, which in my second floor room where the tank is is about 75. I appreciate the input about health and behavior above 80, and I'll certainly set my new tank up to match their ideal environment. That's why I'm here, so do you recommend any other tank mates?

LFS only had four clown loaches. I will quarantine new additions.

[Loachloach]

As redshark suggested, temperature wise these two are not compatible.

Having said that, clown loaches have no problem being healthy at 75. I've seen lots of posts suggesting they'll "instantly" get white spot, or whatever but clown loaches are very tolerant of extremes providing one doesn't take it for granted.

Mine spent an entire winter of almost 6 months at 74F up until a couple of weeks ago, and grew during that period, were, healthy, eating and playing while at this temperature as if nothing changed. This was not by design, my heater couldn't hold up the temperature anymore and I never got around at buying a new one because they are ridiculous price locally but I finally did buy one online recently and got them back up.

And generally, I keep lower temps during the winter, give the other fish a break, so around 6 months at 77, summer temps than go up to 85 for another 6 months, so I kind of have 2 seasons in their tank and it's worked fine for me so far. However, one has to look after these fish for years and I can't predict the long term outcome. All I am saying, they stay very healthy, at least visually wise, at lower than ideal temeratures.

And they don't always get white spot. It probably really depends on the source. I bought loaches 3 times, got white spot only with the last purchase of a small clown loach, and I actually never saw any white spots on him, just flashing but treated precautionary with salt and heat and it was gone quickly.

Whatever you chose as tank mates, try to get outgoing and friendly fish to act as dithers, and also such that don't feed at all levels of the tank to interfere with clown loaches. Rainbows are good, my smaller type blue eyed forktail rainbows are very nice fish, keep to the top and don't interact with bottom feeders, but act as dithers.

[Nick Hancock]

Well, it's good to know they'll be fine for the time being. For what it's worth after only four days, they seem happy and active, even though they're still reclusive in the new environment and scatter when I step all the way into the room. I dropped a new plant in when I added the clowns and it had tons of small ramshorns on it, and I found my first empty shell today.

I will keep the new tank at or right around 80. It's a blank slate at this point, so those are the kinds of tips/parameters I'm here for. I'll add some rainbows. It sounds like you're saying the mid-bottom should pretty much be the domain of the clown loaches. No pleco, I'd imagine, right? SAEs?

[Loachloach]

I would not add a pleco or anything that feeds from the bottom or comes near it. I have a pleco too. He's a sweep machine.
I have greedy livebearers with mine as well and they eat right down at the bottom, the top, the middle, the sides, the corners, out of the pleco's mouth... and almost right out of my table.
If you want a nicer setup, rainbows or anything that keeps at the top is best. My rainbows never ever touch the bottom for anything at all and I like it this way. Wish I thought of this stuff myself some years back.

This doesn't mean you can't add any other bottom feeders but it will make your life easier if you don't, and the fish's.
I am not certain where SAE's eat. I like them myself and always wanted some, plus they eat black brush algae which is a bonus. But I can't advise on their eating behaviour. They all differ.

[Nick Hancock]

I would not add a pleco or anything that feeds from the bottom or comes near it. I have a pleco too. He's a sweep machine.
I have greedy livebearers with mine as well and they eat right down at the bottom, the top, the middle, the sides, the corners, out of the pleco's mouth... and almost right out of my table.
If you want a nicer setup, rainbows or anything that keeps at the top is best. My rainbows never ever touch the bottom for anything at all and I like it this way. Wish I thought of this stuff myself some years back.

Lol. That makes sense, and I'm sure it makes feeding particular foods easier. My small tanks tend to be free-for-alls. No aggression, I just have trouble getting the right fish to eat the right foods sometimes.

I'll start with a couple species of rainbow, maybe one more species of peaceful, definite top feeder and a couple more clown loaches (after a nice, thorough quarantine for everybody). I'd assume for shoaling purposes that I should introduce my existing four and the new additions to the new tank at the same time, so I'll try to time my quarantine with my tank cycling and my change of residence.

I'll check into SAEs. What I see on internet resources suggests that 80+ might be a tad warm for them, anyway. All of them seem to clearly delineate the top of the range in the high 70s.

Thank you both for your time on this!

[mikev]

I'd compromise at 78f for now. Yes, Sewellia will be fine even at 82f, but I'd rather keep them more comfortable, clowns will be ok at lower temp.

As for plecos: nothing wrong and helps keeping the tank cleaner (I have a few bristlenose plecos in the 125g big loach tank). Garras is another option to look at, they are more fun than plecos to watch.

[Nick Hancock]

Thanks mikev! I took a look at some garras--the panda looks like a cool fish. I have a clown pleco and a bristlenose in other tanks, so maybe I'll go that route. I have not seen them locally, but I'm sure LFS can order.

[mikev]

Very welcome.

Yes, panda garra is a fascinating little fish and I'm sure you would love them. If you are in the US, you can usually find them online.

BUT: If I were in your situation (setting up 125g) I'd go one step further and research larger garra species. Panda garra is only 2.5" max, something that gets to 4" may be even better.

[Loachloach]

As for plecos: nothing wrong and helps keeping the tank cleaner (I have a few bristlenose plecos in the 125g big loach tank). Garras is another option to look at, they are more fun than plecos to watch.

It depends on the pleco type and their character. My bristlenose pleco is in with corys. He will not move more than 5cm out of his cave if I am around, and I have to put the food close to his cave because by the time he does move, the food is gone.
When he comes out he pushes the corys away without a problem, even squished one once almost to death as he wouldn't let go of it and lied down on top while the poor cory was trying to get loose. But I doubt it he'll push away any of my bigger clown loaches. So he may starve in a loach tank to be honest, most of the time and rely on algae. But bristlenose plecos love their meaty food and it's good to have some in their diet.

Then on another hand, if it's anything like my other pleco, he sends the loaches into the air when he dives into the food. They absolutely can't compete with him and because of their skittish behaviour, they won't approach him or the food while he eats until he moves away. They won't touch his veg too, so they don't get any veg or fruit even though I put regularly some in the tank. Thus I am depriving the loaches having a pleco in with them. On the same note however, the pleco lets the corys eat around his mouth and doesn't consider them a threat. So he has preferences (he makes violent moves with his tail if a clown loach approaches) But I raised him with the same corys so he seems to tolerate them a lot. I've never seen him squish a cory or any fish and he's several times larger than the bristlenose. He's more docile but his mere size terrifies the loaches.

[Nick Hancock]

Good to know! I have them housed in a more appropriate temporary tank now, and I've added two running mates. They're at 81 with a lot of fast growing plants, sand, some pebbles, and two big chunks of Mopani with all kinds of cool caves. Kuhli loaches, a couple dwarf gouramis and some harlequin raspbora. It's temporary, as it's too small for any extended period of time. No algae eater solution in there yet--playing it by ear. I'll likely replace them with a small shoal of a smaller botia species when their permanent home is set up.