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mousey
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new to loaches

Post by mousey » Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:36 pm

Hi,
i recently bought 4 loaches that were called polka dot. there was no scientific name given. i have looked at many loach sites on the internet and have not seen anything that resembles them. i am wondering if they are juveniles? they are about 2-3 inches long, are generally silvery bodied but have brownish color spots on them. the spots are irregular.
They can be a bit pushy-- knocking the swordtails out of the way to get at food.
I read that loaches have little blades under their eyes!! is that true? also they are scaleless fish?
they remind me of SAE's in a lot of ways.
Sorry i have no idea how to post pics even if i could get hubby to take them.
Any ideas on what these could be?

Mark in Vancouver
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Post by Mark in Vancouver » Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:59 pm

Probably it's Botia kubotai- it was briefly called Botia angellicus. Here's one of Martin's mature specimens:

Image

They have many different patterns and variations, probably due to being spread out geographically. I don't think they are bred in captivity yet, so they're a little rare - seasonal at best.

Go to the species index:

http://www.loaches.com/species_index.html

Check out Botia kubotai and see if you find a match. Also, check out the loach photo site:

http://www2.2cah.com/coppermine/

Botia histrionica is a similar species, and Botia almorhae can also start life looking like the polka dot loach.
Your vantage point determines what you can see.

poeticpyro
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Post by poeticpyro » Tue Feb 07, 2006 11:59 pm

try http://badmanstropicalfish.com

i have found a ton of stuff on loaches there... they could be burmese border loaches, they are sometimes accidentally called polka dot... and yes the juviniles don't always look like the adults... there's also a good loach species index on here, but it didn't help me with a couple of my little guys. take care, happy fish hunting... welcome and tell us what you turn up! i'm looking for polka dotted ones as well.. hard to come by...
many tanks...

got to love my fat little wobbly wigglies...

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mikev
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Post by mikev » Wed Feb 08, 2006 12:06 am

Usually Polka-Dot means these guys:
http://www.loaches.com/species_pages/bo ... anmar.html
Scientific names: Botia kubotai (new), Botia Angelicus (old).

If these are the ones, 2"-3" makes them subadults.

These guys are generally not too aggressive but like most loaches would be nervous initially and may try to attack slow fish. In my case, they (at 1") victimized gouramis (about 3"): attached themselves to the gourami's fins to catch a free ride.

True on blades and scaleless.

mousey
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Post by mousey » Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:02 pm

Hi again. After much time on the internet until the wee hours and again tonight for another 3 hrs i finally found what i had. initially i thought i had mottled loaches but with further searching they are called polkadotted loach-- not to be confused with polka dot loaches! They are Nemacheilus corica. they have the double row of slash marks from the head to the top fin and they have a notch in the top fin. i have been looking at them with a magnifying glass to try to see all the detail on them. The tails have only light marking whereas the mottled loach has quite dark tail.
I am somewhat perturbed as i thought they would like each others company, but the little info i have found seems to indicate they should be kept alone in the tank. Comments??
i also read that hillside loaches probably need more oxygen in the tank than a regular filter will give them.
Any comments?? they are kind of cute. the colors are darker than they were the first couple of days i had them.
1 has a bleeding whisker tonight. maytbe caught it on the gravel? they have been sticking thier noses in the gravel and trying to toss it. oh and they sometimes sleep on their sides on top of the plants.Lookslike they are dead then.
All info appreciated
Thanks
mousey

Mark in Vancouver
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Post by Mark in Vancouver » Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:10 pm

Ahhh. That makes sense. You are still lucky to find them. I've never seen these loaches around here.

Hillside is an apt name for them, as opposed to "hillstream". They're also called brook loaches, and my belief is that they should be kept as you would keep Schistura, Acanthocobitis, and a number of other torpedo-shaped loaches.

I think Graeme keeps these guys....?

Add at least a powerhead and run it just beneath the surface for maximum effect. Or, like so many here, get weird about it and build them a proper river tank with increased flow and other features.
Your vantage point determines what you can see.

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Graeme Robson
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Post by Graeme Robson » Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:37 am

Nemacheilus corica are indeed a great find. Unfortunately, i don't keep these. I would follow Mark's advice on tank set-up. Like many Nemacheilus's and Schistura's, they require their own space within the aquarium. They are quite Territorial at times.

Two other things that worry me is your substrate and N. corica laying on it's side. Can you change your substrate to a finer one? I've never herd of any Nemacheilus or Schistura's sleeping on there sides, i hope your water parameters are good and the water temperature is below 79/26.

Good luck with your great find. :D

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Emma Turner
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Post by Emma Turner » Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:17 pm

Hi mousey,

Although I do not keep N. corica at home, we have imported them to our shop on a few occassions. From what I have seen, when kept in large numbers in a stock tank they seem to get on fine together - but I suspect that like other similar species they would be fairly territorial in the home aquarium, especially when kept in smaller numbers.
Here's a pic of some juveniles:

Image

And here's a (fat!) adult:

Image

Make sure that you provide them with ample space and hiding places for them to create their territories, plus they also like a decent flow, as others have mentioned here. You should seriously think about changing your substrate to sand as it is kinder on the fish's delicate barbel area. I have never seen any Nemacheilus lying on their sides, but have seen them cramming themselves under bogwood together.

Emma

p.s. Graeme - if you're tempted, we've got some in right now!!! :wink: :wink: :wink:
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Graeme Robson
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Post by Graeme Robson » Thu Feb 09, 2006 3:19 pm

Emma Turner wrote:p.s. Graeme - if you're tempted, we've got some in right now!!! :wink: :wink: :wink:
I'll be definitely passing through Peterborough are this summer, Emma. It should be around June/July. Although a nice car drive and the array of Loaches in your store might call for a early drive! :wink:

Graeme.

mousey
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Post by mousey » Thu Feb 09, 2006 4:21 pm

yes Emma those are the little guys. Were you aware that they have notch on the top fin?
They are slowly getting used to me and Don't fly off when I look at them. They are still not sure about hubby!
most people never think that fish have any recognition of people but they really do. when ever the grandkids enter my living room it appears as if my tanks are empty!!
So far so good. they have a piece of bog wood to go under and the tank is fairly heavily planted. the one that was lying on his side was on top of a plant and was apparently sleeping. he decided to zoom off and go to another location when he waked. . they seem healthy. Today I have been on the phone trying to locate aquarium sand for my new panda cories too. Our stores here just say to buy sandbox sand and wash it to clean it. How does one wash sand without a lot of wastage?
The local fish store tells me i don't need to get sand. i often wonder why petstores and fish specialty stores give you bad info. is it to sell more fish?
For the pandas I have pushed the gravel to the back of the tank and have left the front bare so the pandas have a choice. have given these guys a bunch of small vals to hang out in and a huge java fern. They are sharing a tank with platy fry.
Sorry, not loaches!
mousey

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Martin Thoene
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Post by Martin Thoene » Thu Feb 09, 2006 10:12 pm

Hi mousey and welcome to LOl.

I started to answer your PM from Aquatic Hobbyist, but somehow lost the almost finished mail. Discovering you here at the web's premier Loach site, I thought I'd answer your mail here.

Your frustrations with unskilled fish catchers at large retail chains is a shared one. No doubt with others here. I ask for fish. If the guy is hamfisted I will ask him to let me catch them. If that's not an option, I walk. I once asked for 3 pairs of an easily sexable barb species in a BA's. The guy had no clue how to sex them, so I said that I could. He asked me how long I'd kept fish. I said since 1964.....he gave me the net.

I buy fish all over. Whoever has what I want at the right price in healthy tanks. Those BA's offers are sometimes excellent. I got 20 near adult Tiger-Barbs from the Kennedy Road BA's for $1.99 each. Two days later, they were $3.45. They are swimming in a 6 foot tank with my 13 Clown Loaches now.

Best place I go and would recommend? The Menagerie Petshop, 549, Parliament Street, Toronto. 416-921-4966, ask for fish department.
A short drive down the 404 from Newmarket....well there's enough commuting going on everyday anyway :wink:

E-mail Harold at: menageriepetshop@bellnet.ca and ask to be placed on their weekly mailing list. Every Friday usually, you'll get a mail with a pdf document containing pictures and news of new fish and plant arrivals.
Imports from all over and some of the nicest plants you'll find anywhere. Good prices too.

And I don't work for BA's or The Menagerie either.

Martin.
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mousey
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Post by mousey » Fri Feb 10, 2006 10:29 pm

Hi, i am confused! is the forums.loaches.com the same as the Aquatic hobbyist?and the loaches.com forum? i seem to see some familiar names at each.

thanks

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Martin Thoene
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Post by Martin Thoene » Fri Feb 10, 2006 10:52 pm

No mousey, not the same forum, it's just that a lot of us don't limit ourselves to just the one loach venue. I think part of that is that not everyone knows of LOL and you can sometimes find good information or knowledge elsewhere. While checking out other sites, it's quite often you'll see a Q you can answewr, so you do.

My speciality is Hillstream Loaches, so i try to answer as many Q's on as many forums that I see them and link my articles so that people get to know what these fish require. I do it more for the fish's benefit to be honest.

Please remember that LOL is far more than a Forum, the website contains great info on keeping loaches and is soon to be updated by a bunch of us members to bring it up to current knowledge levels.

Martin.
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Jim Powers
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Post by Jim Powers » Sat Feb 11, 2006 1:37 am

I used to have N. corica. They are a great fish. Like many of the smaller nemacheilus/schistura (brook loaches) they have a better disposition than the larger ones. They are not overly territorial and seem to like the company of others of their kind or similar species. They often dig in the substrate (gravel in my case). I even kept them with breeding hillstreams and never observed any predation on the young.
Its interesting that while these fish were very common up until a couple of years ago, I have not seen them since.

mousey
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Post by mousey » Mon Feb 13, 2006 4:38 pm

yes they do dig! it's a wonder they don't hurt themselves. Mine have currently divided the tank up into quadrants. they do fraternize at times but there was an awful row this morning when someone got under someone else's piece of mopani wood!! they jumped on each other and there was a lot of tail wagging going on.
One has decided to try to eat at the surface of the water.he has had a couple of run ins with the swordtail and platys as a result.
I am having a hard time distinguishing between them. I wonder if the one is the same kind as his markings are more like lines and the others have irregular circular marks. His tail and fin coloring is the same and his face looks the same. Perhaps a variation or from a different litter?
I love the front fins-- they are so long and graceful.
They certainly won't go hungry! i notice they have a very keen sense of smell and within seconds of the food hitting the water they suddenly appear from their hiding places and go right after it.
I guess that is the reason it was said not to mix them with corydoras-- that lot can't find anything too much in the tank!
Mouse

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