Clown loach laying eggs

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Jen1782
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Clown loach laying eggs

Post by Jen1782 » Mon Jul 16, 2018 5:28 pm

Hi all,
I'm an amateur fish keeper- have had my aquarium 2.5yrs and have two clown loaches plus a variety of other species.
I did a complete water change on Thursday evening and on Friday my female loach started laying eggs! Now I immediately went to the web to find out what to do but found that this is a VERY rare phenomenon. I took a number of pictures and managed to fish a few eggs into a net suspended in the water to keep them safe but unfortunately (awful timing) I had a holiday booked this weekend and came back to find all the eggs had gone (even from the net which the angel fish was consistently nudging) the eggs were too small for a breeding unit and kept falling through the spaces in the bottom. I am very upset I couldn't do anything more but I was totally unprepared. The loaches are still dancing, attached to each other and very pale but she is not producing eggs right now.
I am seeking advice: 1) do I need to buy a mesh hatchery or something to help secure the eggs? 2) how often do they produce eggs when spawning/ how long does it last? 3) is there anything specific I should be doing?
Please don't post a reply if you are going to say it is unlikely or not possible... I am an educated teacher and am aware that unusual behaviour teamed with 20 or so amber globe and tube like forms produced from my loach are likely to be eggs. I also have pictures of the eggs themselves, pictures of the female producing them and a video of an egg I got into the net wriggling to prove it. If someone can show me how to post these I will pop them up for people to see.
Thank you so much in advance for any advice.

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redshark1
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Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, England, Great Britain.

Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by redshark1 » Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:10 pm

Hi that's interesting and deserving of a reply.

I've heard of this happening a few times before though the eggs have always been infertile.

They have been bred using hormones of course.

However, as this is very expensive there is great commercial interest in breeding Clown Loaches without hormones.

This is why they mostly come from the wild in an unsustainable way, although people studying them have shown ways in which they "could" in theory be produced sustainably.

My fish have never done what yours have. However, my water changes are always 25%.

If it happened to me I would cancel my holiday and as I am an experienced breeder of other species I would replicate what I have found successful before in the hope that the eggs were fertile and could be raised.

As you realise photos are essential and when I last posted pics in Jan I was advised to use this website. It worked well: https://imgur.com/
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=42173

Not sure what you mean by the egg wriggling however.

What are the ages and sizes of your fishies?
6 x Clown Loaches all 30 years of age on 01.01.2024, largest 11.5", 2 large females, 4 smaller males, aquarium 6' x 18" x 18" 400 ltr/90 uk gal/110 US gal. approx.

Bas Pels
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Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by Bas Pels » Wed Jul 18, 2018 3:04 am

Please tell us more. This is not rare, this is highly exceptional

Jen1782
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Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by Jen1782 » Wed Jul 18, 2018 4:15 am

Thanks for your responses.
They are still going it seems and she has been producing eggs for about 5 days now- Unfortunately I lost the first ones which seemed to be wriggling. I have a video of that but am really struggling to attach pictures and videis- I will try later on.
I have now siphoned off what I can into a hatchery but it seems that they might be unfertilised as they are slowly turning white. My female seems to be a lot bigger than my male so im not certain he is doing his part so to speak. I'm wondering if there is anything I can do to help them along. Does the male fertilise them after they are produced?
In terms of conditions etc I have white sand, two large rounded white rocks which I have used to create a cave, I have three large plants and their tank mates are two angelfish, a few tetras and three endler guppies. The temperature is at 29/30c which I know is high but I fiddled with my heater when doing the complete clean out and washing the sand through and then they starting spawning so I just left conditions as they were.
I used a fluvial cycle biological enhancer straight after clean out and added a bacteria stone to the filter.
My fish are 2.5/3 years old and about 6/7 inches long.

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redshark1
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Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, England, Great Britain.

Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by redshark1 » Wed Jul 18, 2018 4:56 pm

Hi I would think that the female and male produce the gametes simultaneously when they swim tightly side by side and the eggs are therefore fertilised immediately when they are expelled.

Your fish were probably already a year old when you purchased them.

I do not know why the eggs are infertile but this has always been the case in these situations (except in one or two unsubstantiated claims that are thought to be highly dubious).
6 x Clown Loaches all 30 years of age on 01.01.2024, largest 11.5", 2 large females, 4 smaller males, aquarium 6' x 18" x 18" 400 ltr/90 uk gal/110 US gal. approx.

loachnoob
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Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by loachnoob » Wed Jul 18, 2018 9:08 pm

There are a lot of hosting sites, youtube.com for videos is incredibly easy. For images imgur.com is easy as well.

Look forward to seeing your uploads!

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redshark1
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Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, England, Great Britain.

Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by redshark1 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 4:55 am

Its been a week since "educated teacher" Jen1782 wetted our appetites with promises of photographs and videos of "wriggling" Clown Loach eggs.
6 x Clown Loaches all 30 years of age on 01.01.2024, largest 11.5", 2 large females, 4 smaller males, aquarium 6' x 18" x 18" 400 ltr/90 uk gal/110 US gal. approx.

Jen1782
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2018 5:04 pm

Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by Jen1782 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 5:51 am

https://youtu.be/FIA4sRG6aFw

https://youtu.be/QvcQjG4BCvM

https://youtu.be/g-_hcXefkOY

Hope these work... As I say I lost this egg= shame. All others have since turned brown 😫

Jen1782
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Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by Jen1782 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 6:25 am

Someone just told me this is probably a parasite that my female loach has!
Can that be right? She stopped for the day yesterday and they left each other alone but has started again today. I have stopped collecting them as they seem to all turn brown eventually. Hundreds now, will need to clean the tank soon.

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redshark1
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Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by redshark1 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 5:00 pm

OK thanks for posting, better late than never!

So i am looking at orange objects on white gravel both in the net and in the tank.

I am not sure what I am looking at as I have never seen these myself but as far as I am aware Clown Loach eggs measure 0.3mm and are spherical.

So your parasite idea looks more likely to me although I'm not sure it is wriggling as it appears to be moving in the current. My first thought was feces.

Levamisole Hydrochloride is the treatment for internal parasites should you need it (it is used to treat pigs and other farm animals and vets can get it) - but that is all I know as I haven't treated my fish.
Last edited by redshark1 on Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
6 x Clown Loaches all 30 years of age on 01.01.2024, largest 11.5", 2 large females, 4 smaller males, aquarium 6' x 18" x 18" 400 ltr/90 uk gal/110 US gal. approx.

FranM
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Location: Rhode Island USA

Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by FranM » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:59 pm

For a moment I thought that I was looking at Cherry shrimp on the gravel.

Lightening 1
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Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by Lightening 1 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 5:48 pm

My tank has had an Algae bloom for the past 2 weeks, it’s quite a fabulous bright green colour, I was advised by my local aquatic centre to turn off the heater as it is warm here at the moment and turn the light off. I have done regular water changes and cleaned the filter. The temperature here has fallen and the thermometer was reading 21 degrees C so I put the heater back into the tank after cleaning it. The following day my 3 Clown loaches aged about 14 years old and are approx 15 to 20cm long were going crazy in the green tank water, when I checked the temperature it was 29 to 30 degrees so I switched the heater off and did a very slow water change to try and cool it a bit. The following day I thought there was algae on the glass but when I looked closer I could see they were eggs and my Clown Loaches had in fact spawned. I have got the tank at 26.6 degrees as I have read this is the optimal temperature for the eggs to hatch.
Can anyone help me with advice on how I can tell if the eggs are alive, how long it takes them to hatch and what I should feed them on. Any advice would be gratefully received.

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redshark1
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Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by redshark1 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 1:59 pm

So are you saying that the eggs were laid on the glass?

You need to put pictures up to be taken seriously as unfortunately people make claims all the time that are not true. An exceptional event requires exceptional proof.

Found this which might help.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDIeRI_ ... 0907137979

Mine have not spawned yet.

I'd copy what he says in the video and raise them as with any other small fry e.g. zebra danio.

Bear in mind the video is a commercial operation so may not be able to give full details.

Eggs usually get covered by fungus if not viable.
6 x Clown Loaches all 30 years of age on 01.01.2024, largest 11.5", 2 large females, 4 smaller males, aquarium 6' x 18" x 18" 400 ltr/90 uk gal/110 US gal. approx.

FranM
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Location: Rhode Island USA

Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by FranM » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:07 pm

I don’t see anything happening in that video either. Were we supposed to?

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redshark1
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Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, England, Great Britain.

Re: Clown loach laying eggs

Post by redshark1 » Thu Aug 16, 2018 3:47 am

In the video Andre of Bioaquatix explains the pH and hardness essential to hatching eggs and rearing the fry. I thought this information pertinent to the discussion. Sorry for the lack of explanation, I thought watching the video would be self evident.
6 x Clown Loaches all 30 years of age on 01.01.2024, largest 11.5", 2 large females, 4 smaller males, aquarium 6' x 18" x 18" 400 ltr/90 uk gal/110 US gal. approx.

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