Video—please comment

The forum for the very best information on loaches of all types. Come learn from our membership's vast experience!

Moderator: LoachForumModerators

FranM
Posts: 409
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Rhode Island USA

Video—please comment

Post by FranM » Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:58 am

This annoying yo-yo is bothering my clown. Normal? When the yo-yo goes under the belly of the clown do you think worms could be present? This clown has had issues with internal worms before. OR, is this just annoying behavior on the yo-yo part? I haven’t seen pestering towards the other clown. Thanks.

Fran

https://youtu.be/veI3lyM0PqM

User avatar
redshark1
Posts: 461
Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2010 6:58 am
Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire, England, Great Britain.

Re: Video—please comment

Post by redshark1 » Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:26 am

I watched the video and although I don't know what is going on exactly the Clown Loaches look shockingly thin to my eyes (but maybe mine are obese despite my attempt to control feeding to preserve water quality). They also seem rather weak.

My Clown Loaches do not move as gently as that. They are robust and direct. Although I don't keep mine with Yoyos I can tell you that if one of the smaller males did that to one of the bigger fish it would be put soundly in its place. There is a distinct pecking order in my group but as long as individuals respect the order of things they will lay together in peace.
6 x Clown Loaches all twenty-five years of age on 01.01.19, largest 11.5", 2f4m, aquarium 6' x 18" x 18" 400 ltr = 110 US gal.

FranM
Posts: 409
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Rhode Island USA

Re: Video—please comment

Post by FranM » Sun Nov 04, 2018 8:06 am

The larger one has/had (maybe its chronic) skinny disease and has been nursed back to health believe it or not. Ever since I switched them from the 55 to the 120 they have not been great. The color has been gray since Aug 17th.

I’ve asked opinions here about that. I think even you responded too, that it takes time for them to be comfortable in a new place. In addition it was suggested I get a couple more. As I write this the yoyo is continuing to pick at fins and the clown is just taking it. I also notice the front fins on the smaller clown are frayed.

I bought two little clowns yesterday. Really little and I just watched silver dollar chase the hell out of it. I can only find one of the two. Wonder if it’s been killed!!!

I treated with Kusuri prior to adding new additions but the lethargy has been ongoing. Considering Prazipro next. Now I’m stressing over the little ones. I’ve never seen the silver dollars chase anything except themselves. This is getting worse and worse. :-(

NancyD
Posts: 1403
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 9:17 pm
Location: SF bay area,US

Re: Video—please comment

Post by NancyD » Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:16 pm

Your video reminds me of when we had young skunk loaches & SA cichlids, not a good combo. The cichlids spewed food bits from their gills. The skunks learned that & pestered the chiclids' gills all the time waiting for the "food dispensers" to feed them.

That seems similar to your yoyo & clown, except that it's the vent the yoyo is targeting. I wonder if there is some kind of clown digestive issue that encourages that behavior...yes, skunks are often more aggressive than yoyos, although I've never kept yoyos.

I forget what the active ingredients of Kursuri is; I'd go with flubendazole if that's not in it. Something is wrong...You may need to think about rehoming the yoyos. I know your big tank was "supposed" to fix everything but it hasn't yet...I'm sorry Fran.
Image

FranM
Posts: 409
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Rhode Island USA

Re: Video—please comment

Post by FranM » Mon Nov 05, 2018 12:37 am

I did take your advice and NOT do a pair of cichlids. And the yo-yos and clowns were stellar in the 55. Why has this changed in the 120? Maybe the clowns are harboring something and the yoyos know it. I was considering a couple more yo-yos to divert attention to themselves. Yo-yos are extremely active. Never still.

Did you see, Nancy, that I got a couple small clowns but only can find one? I was hoping for strength in numbers with the clowns. Hard to find any this time of year not to mention a decent size. I’ll pay for bigger ones if I could find any. I tried four places.

On a half better note, I think the silver dollar had brain fog for the moment when it chased the little one. The little one was out and about all evening and all four ignored it. I fed the hell out of them yesterday. Thinking of going back and getting the last two teensy clowns I saw, though I wonder if it’s a good idea to get more that small. What do you think. AND, I noticed this too, yesterday—the clowns were spreading their mouths wide open—esp Slim’s. Gills weren’t moving fast though, I was taking notice. That’s why I was thinking Prazipro too

Prazi says NOT to dose with anything else and Kusuri says it’s OK to use in conjunction with something else. Prazi expired 9/2018. Is it worth using?

So. More yoyos-even 1, or not
More tiny clowns?
Tetras to add action and distraction?
More caves? I have 2.
Wide stretched mouths?

Thanks Nancy. I need help—still!

Loachloach
Posts: 702
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:11 pm

Re: Video—please comment

Post by Loachloach » Mon Nov 05, 2018 3:43 pm

Hey Fran,

Only seeing this now.

I think yoyos can be bullies and there are lots of stories them bullying even bigger fish. I personally would not keep clown loaches with any other type of loaches...Hopefully the yoyos behavior is temporary. Does the yoyo has its own kind friends? If he's alone, no wonder he's doing that. They're social fish just like the clown loaches but more yoyos may mean more bullying the low number of clown loaches...

In terms of it poking at the clown's belly, I've actually seen my clowns doing that to each other, in a very gentle way. I think it may got to do with mating behavior or some pecking order...But if the yoyo keeps going, he can stress the clown.

I personally would stop treating the fish with meds. The issue now is not parasites or diseases. Frailed fins is a water quality issue and so is difficulty breathing. Have you tested your water recently?

The more stressed behavior could be due to the white sand combined with more light and the move. White sand reflects light so the clowns don't particularly like it, although mine spent quite a few years on white sand. They were shyer and spooked easier but they were healthy. I was tired of them hiding though....You can try mixing the sand with some river sand if you like the look or just let it be and see how it is long term. I've moved my clowns several times, different tanks and it seems their behavior can change drastically. Mine changed to the better but I purposely set up their last tank the way it is, darker and more subdued and they like it a lot more.

I think adding more fish would not solve much but who can resist some baby clowns :) I had a 4f tank and my initial group was 5 loaches and then a 6th, which was a rescue. I kept them that size group for quite a few years, and it was plenty in a 4f tank. Keep in mind that females grow big and it doesn't take that long, 5 years perhaps for them to be chunky enough to make the tank look small....You were unlucky enough with having a sickly clown loach, which is also a male, so he never grew that big, but thinking back I think yours is older than my oldest clown loaches(I could be wrong) and couple of my first ones I bought in 2012 are now 10 inches, wide girth, big fish, definitely not fish I would have kept in my 4 footer, had it not split open :lol:

I am not sure what I'd do in your situation.....When I had my 4 footer and my clowns, I was afraid of getting any other fish that grows bigger than 2-3 inch...And you've got the silver dollars and now 4 loaches. I think long term that may prove to be plenty as they're alll old lived. I don't know about the yoyo, I wouldn't have got one yoyo in the first place...Or I would have just yoyos, or just clown loaches...

FranM
Posts: 409
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Rhode Island USA

Re: Video—please comment

Post by FranM » Mon Nov 05, 2018 4:01 pm

The tattered front little dorsal fins affects the smaller clown only and only the front fins. I can say with 100% confidence, water quality is not an issue.

I have two yoyos. They pester with each other and they sometimes dive and nip the silver dollars (4). I have the lighting so subdued I can’t stand it but I will leave it. There are definitely shady spots in the tank. Clowns are always out but like redshark said, they are not “robust”. I was expecting an Ich issue with the move but nothing happened, but maybe the older clown, being weak, may have a worm issue again.

Only one teensy clown has survived and it was out and about in front of the four silver dollars and they didn’t even look twice. Thankfully that worry of it getting eaten is hopefully over.

I think the yoyos took over the big tank. THEY are robust and growing—especially the bigger one. I actually like the yoyos but not when they pull rank over clowns. I don’t think the oldest clown is over six years old. The smaller one younger.

I’m hoping bumping up the clown numbers and adding some tetras will mix things up a bit. I’m not ready to give up the yoyos yet. I was given them (I didn’t get them myself) as skinny runts. They have blossomed.

Thanks for your input Loach.

NancyD
Posts: 1403
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 9:17 pm
Location: SF bay area,US

Re: Video—please comment

Post by NancyD » Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:38 pm

Fran, I don't think the yawning is anything to worry about. Mine did it sometimes but not often. I'm not sure what it means if they do it frequently.

I'm sorry you lost 1 new clown :( Kursuri does have flubendazole so I agree, no more worming meds are needed.

I think at this point another cave or 2 may help, but I would not add more fish right now, certainly not another species.

It may be that your gentle clowns are intimidated by the big dollars & rowdier yoyos. We've talked about that before...I don't have anything new to suggest.

If this "bad fish behavior" continues I think you're going to have some tough choices ahead...I'm sorry, but it may come down to that for long term success of a healthy & compatible tank...You're having to work too hard at this.
Image

FranM
Posts: 409
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Rhode Island USA

Re: Video—please comment

Post by FranM » Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:54 pm

This tank with the exact same inhabitants from the several year established 55 wasn’t an issue before I switched over. Maybe it still isn’t. Mr Slim is showing a bit slimmer top of body so I think Kusuri was a good move.

The video quality sucks. I had to record through YouTube app and was unable to upload my iphone video to YouTube. Don’t know why.

This was taken 40 minutes after feeding.

https://youtu.be/eocIH9iWeyA

NancyD
Posts: 1403
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 9:17 pm
Location: SF bay area,US

Re: Video—please comment

Post by NancyD » Mon Nov 05, 2018 11:30 pm

Yeah, but when you move fish or tanks all the dynamics change...
Image

Loachloach
Posts: 702
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:11 pm

Re: Video—please comment

Post by Loachloach » Tue Nov 06, 2018 1:48 am

I don't see any issues on the video. The fish seem just fine :)

FranM
Posts: 409
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Rhode Island USA

Re: Video—please comment

Post by FranM » Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:03 am

Nancy, yeah, I see what you mean. Like the yoyos think the tank is theirs and the others are privileged to be there.

And Loach, yes, last night things looked normal like the old way. The only issue I had was Teensy clown was nowhere to be found. Sheesh!!

I’ve been feeding more than usual too and so, I believe it was you, Loach, who said you spread the frozen food around so everyone got their share. I like that idea a lot. I always hand fed a cube of frozen food to loaches first while I tried to get the silver dollars to go to another part of the tank with another cube. This new way is so much better and more of a challenge spreading defrosted worms or shrimp everywhere.

I’m gonna keep praying, and looking for larger clowns. I think the goal is to outnumber the yoyos. I really do like the yoyos. I hope all will coexist.

So for four loaches and four silver dollars, how many cubes of frozen worms or shrimp should I be feeding? Three at once? Four? Two and two, meaning devour two, then add two more? I watched the whole feeding process and everywhere along the bottom, and plants, was scoured. REALLY liked the spreading around of the food and probably safer not being frozen too.

Thanks.

PS: new video upload with Vimeo. Apparently I don’t have an app to upload my videos onto YouTube anymore so I tried something new. The quality is clearer, especially on closeups. I will have to delete videos, though, if I want to upload another. I’ve already used nearly all my free storage.

https://vimeo.com/299161345

UPDATE!!!! BOTH teensies are still there. Couldn’t capture on video, but they are there!!!! 🙏🏼

Fran

rock28
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:20 am

Re: Video—please comment

Post by rock28 » Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:10 pm

How We can post the video in the comment of this post. I just know how can I post the link of the video on here and not know the video comment. Please describe more on here.http://www.buttetowing.com/helena-mt.html

NancyD
Posts: 1403
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 9:17 pm
Location: SF bay area,US

Re: Video—please comment

Post by NancyD » Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:45 pm

That's fantastic news on the little 1, Fran :D Loaches can be very good at hiding.

It sounds like feeding more & spreading it out is working well! I forget, do you also feed a but when the tank lights are out too? Your loaches are all young & growing. That may be part of the yoyos behavior, if they're always hungry. A small second feeding might be good.

Your newest video looks good!
Image

FranM
Posts: 409
Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Rhode Island USA

Re: Video—please comment

Post by FranM » Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:07 pm

Thanks, Nancy.

I don’t feed when lights are out but I’ve been feeding first thing in the morning the last few days. They are probably still foraging.

And that’s TWO little ones. I felt for sure one of the little ones was a goner.

😃

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 18 guests