help - Rapid breathing and odd behaviour

[victor]

Hi,

I've got a problem with one of my clown loaches and I have no idea what is wrong.

For the last week almost i've noticed that one of the loaches has been constantly breathing rapidly with its mouth open.

He/She is also behaving strangly. All my loaches are usually hide inside a big hollow rock during the day but this one no longer seems to care for hiding and just sits outside the tank now. And before they usually dive for cover when they see activity outside the tank but this one again doesnt really seem phased at all. Other than that though he seems fine. Swims normally and physically looks fine (pic attached).


Also i dont know if this is of any relevance, but he does appear to be the smallest of the 6 but only slightly and his stripes are alot darker than his tank mates.

Tank Specs
2.5ft 40 gallon which has been setup for about 5 weeks now.
Canister filter 1000Litre/hour flow rate (and cycled for 5 weeks + i've added cycling bacteria at the start)
water temp is around 78F
25% water change every week and filter cleaned every 3-4weeks
Nothing has been changed in the tank recently
Ammonia 0
Nitrate 0
Nitrite - No test kit
PH - No test kit
TankMates - 2 white clouds and 3 guppies and 20ish 3week old guppy fry
Aerator rated for 100gallon tank

Thanks for any help, really appreciate it.
Victor

[Diana]

The fish looks hollow in the belly area, between about the pectorals and the pelvic fins. Does he also look hollow along the dorsal area, from about the head to dorsal fin? Smallest fish, lowest ranking = poorly fed. The other fish are taking his food.

Gills look brown. Prime symptom of Brown Blood Disease. This affects fish when there is nitrite in the water. Nitrite crosses the gills and enters the blood. It makes the blood so it cannot carry oxygen very well, and the blood changes color (hence the common name of this problem). Rapid or heavy breathing because the fish is starving for oxygen.

This may have come about because the tank may not be fully cycled.
If you added nitrifying bacteria a week or more before adding fish, but did not feed the bacteria, then the bacteria have died, and you are doing a fish-in cycle. If the bacteria you added were the wrong species then they do little to help a cycling tank, and again you are cycling with fish in the tank.
Is this the time-table:
10 weeks ago set up tank and added cycle bacteria
5 weeks ago added fish
1 week ago noticed this little guy's problem

Test results that also lead me to think this tank is not cycled:
Ammonia 0 ppm (good for 5 weeks of fish-in cycle)
Nitrite: no test (the bacteria that remove nitrite are slow growing, and nitrite climbs in a cycling tank until the population is high enough to match the ammonia removing bacteria production of nitrite. This can take up to 8 weeks with a fish-in cycle)
Nitrate: 0 ppm. Unless the tank is heavily planted there ought to be some nitrate showing up. Even though the bacteria that turn nitrite into nitrate are slow, they should be there in enough numbers by now to produce some nitrate.

What I would do now:
Get a nitrite test, even if you have to run a sample to the LFS.
Water changes, including gravel vacs to lower the nitrites and reduce the load of organics (These decompose to form ammonia and other things) Try three times per week. Clean the filter media gently, the bacteria are still growing. Do not throw away filter media. Get rid of the waste matter in there, though.
Add salt (sodium chloride) at the rate of 1 teaspoon per 20 gallons (5 ml per 76 liters)

When you get a nitrite test, gauge water changes to keep the nitrites under 1 ppm until the cycle is complete.

[victor]

Hi Diana,

Thanks so much for your lengthy reply.

I took your advice and ran down to the LFS and got a nitrite kit and the LFS was kind enough to show me how to do the test with the sample water i had bought. However nitrites came up as 0 as well. This been said i did a 25% water change just 1.5 days ago.

Your guess with the timetable is close. Except i added the fish when the tank was setup and used the bacteria (seachem stability) to 'cycle' it.

I dont know what a skinny loach is suppose to look like but i had a look at the other loaches and they did seem alot fatter than this loach as well as been bigger. However i know that there is plenty of food to go around since I put food in a breeding net that sink into the tank and after the feeding times there is always food left over in the net.

With the cleaning the filter, i've only been tipping out the gunk at the bottom since the filter material hasnt needed any changing or cleaning just yet.

Is it possible that its some sort of disease or parasite thats causing the brown gills. Otherwise i guess if i just keep up with monitoring the water quality and water changes he should recover hopefully?

Thanks again for the help!

[reaper]

what do you feed your loaches ? any frozen or ?

if for some reason your loaches isnt getting fed because of other fish taking the food this is what i do and what i normally feed my fish

get a mixture of frozen daphna and blood worm, get a cup full of water from the tank and drop them in,

leave it to settle and break up, give a stir with a spoon to help. then pour into the tank starting from one side and finish at the other. this way i know that all the fish are getting something to eat.

hope your loach is doing good

[Diana]

There are other diseases and parasites that can attack the gills. Perhaps something that will give them that off-color look.

Skinny fish might have internal parasites (very common with Loaches, I treat while they are in quarantine)

Might have some sort of infection. Or both.

Could be the bigger fish are hogging the food, and this guy is not feeling up to competing. But if there is still food in your feeder and this guy is not eating even when food is available it points more and more to some sort of disease or parasite.

I would do either of 2 things:
A) isolate and treat per Shari's article
B) treat main tank per Shari's article. If this little guy has shared his parasites then they are all possibly infested, but at a low enough level that they are not showing symptoms... yet.

http://www.loaches.com/Members/shari2/l ... chloride-1

[aw-fish]

I have added a new clown loach to my tank and he looks exactly the same.

I thought he only had the ich when I got him. (I felt bad for the guy and have treated many fishes for ich before. Usually, not a big deal.)

This guy seems to display more symptoms, however, and I have a bad feeling about this.

My fish book suggest the following possibilities.

Ectoparasites in the gills
internal parasites (hence the skinny tummy) or both
bullying and no food
and fish TB (ugh)

MY QUESTION: what treatment (pet shop medicine or particular chemicals) do you suggest for clown loaches? (I have bread bettas, angels, gouramis, had cichlids of all sorts, and have successfully treated them for internal worms with horse dewormer, e.g. BUT I am new to clown loaches. The are more sensitive to some of these treatments.

[cashmart35]

ok...question on whats up with my clown loach. I have a 15 gallon tank with 2 neon tetras, 1 black phantom tetra, and 2 clown loaches. The fish have been in the tank 3 days now and they are also the first fish to live in this tank. The ammonia is neutral, the PH is neutral, and the water temp is good. All the fish are doing great except for 1 clown loach. He/she is always getting into a corner than laying on it's side. It'll lay there for hours and you'll swear it's dead, but one little poke and it'll start swimming around like nothing is wrong.

ceiling fan parts
http://ceilingfansparts.net/

[loachlover77]

ok...question on whats up with my clown loach. I have a 15 gallon tank with 2 neon tetras, 1 black phantom tetra, and 2 clown loaches. The fish have been in the tank 3 days now and they are also the first fish to live in this tank. The ammonia is neutral, the PH is neutral, and the water temp is good. All the fish are doing great except for 1 clown loach. He/she is always getting into a corner than laying on it's side. It'll lay there for hours and you'll swear it's dead, but one little poke and it'll start swimming around like nothing is wrong.

ceiling fan parts
http://ceilingfansparts.net/

Clown loaches that lay on their sides is normal. This is how they sleep. They will also sleep upside down. My clowns do this all the time. If everything is normal in your tank then just enjoy your clown loaches. I would also watch them carefully and make sure that they don't get ich or any other disease.

[loachlover77]

Hi,

I've got a problem with one of my clown loaches and I have no idea what is wrong.

For the last week almost i've noticed that one of the loaches has been constantly breathing rapidly with its mouth open.

He/She is also behaving strangly. All my loaches are usually hide inside a big hollow rock during the day but this one no longer seems to care for hiding and just sits outside the tank now. And before they usually dive for cover when they see activity outside the tank but this one again doesnt really seem phased at all. Other than that though he seems fine. Swims normally and physically looks fine (pic attached).


Also i dont know if this is of any relevance, but he does appear to be the smallest of the 6 but only slightly and his stripes are alot darker than his tank mates.

Tank Specs
2.5ft 40 gallon which has been setup for about 5 weeks now.
Canister filter 1000Litre/hour flow rate (and cycled for 5 weeks + i've added cycling bacteria at the start)
water temp is around 78F
25% water change every week and filter cleaned every 3-4weeks
Nothing has been changed in the tank recently
Ammonia 0
Nitrate 0
Nitrite - No test kit
PH - No test kit
TankMates - 2 white clouds and 3 guppies and 20ish 3week old guppy fry
Aerator rated for 100gallon tank

Thanks for any help, really appreciate it.
Victor

Mine rapidly breathe when they are stressed. This could be the case with your clown loach. If he continues to get skinny then he could have worms or parasites.

I hope that your clown loach feels better soon.

[ClownLoachSharky]

15 gallons is way too small. its prob stress from tiny tank