Clown Loach Expanding -- Please Help!

[starsplitter7]

Here are my tank parameters.
80 degrees
pH 7.0
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10-20
My sick fish looks perfect. Not a scratch on her, perfect fins, nice gills, clear eyes, healthy skin, plump, but not bloated. She was healthy three days ago -- swimming around the tank and eating well. I put her back in the hatcher under the water flow, and she's being calm.

Never showed any signs of illness. Beautiful.

She isn't breathing hard now, but still can't swim.

I have reset up the Q-tank with 20% tank water, and 60% treated water with Prime and Conditioner (20% to splash the water). Should I leave her resting in the hatcher, or further stress her and move her into the Q-tank?

I will look into the Prazipro (I haven't seen it at PetSmart, but I will look again, and I have a Petco too), and I think I will need to treat the entire main tank. Is this safe for my delicate fish? Eels, loaches, African Butterflies . . . I still want to treat my fish, because my Danios are thin.

Could it be that she got a bad dose of Nitrate and is having Osmosis issues? Now that the water is cleaner, could she possibly recover?

Thanks again. Tanja.

[chefkeith]

I agree with Tinman. You can slow down on the water changes. 2- 20% water changes per week is what most recommend.

Like Tinman said, a TDS meter is great tool to have around. Once you know the initial TDS from the tap water, you can then compare it to the final TDS of the aquarium water. If the aquarium TDS is 50+ ppm higher than the source water then you know there a pollution problem somewhere that might be causing harm to the fish.

In places where there is no large fresh water source, like Flordia, there might even be a large change in the tap water TDS from week to week, so that should be monitored with each aquarium water change. If there is a large change in the tap water TDS, then water changes need to be smaller.

[chefkeith]

You can leave the loach in the hatcher.

What is the Conditioner your adding to the water?

You should treat the all your tanks with Prazipro. IME, it's very safe for healthy fish, but also shrimp, snails, and plants. If the fish are heavily infected with worms, then they might not be feeling so good for a few days.

[starsplitter7]

You can leave the loach in the hatcher.

What is the Conditioner your adding to the water?

You should treat the all your tanks with Prazipro. IME, it's very safe for healthy fish, but also shrimp, snails, and plants. If the fish are heavily infected with worms, then they might not be feeling so good for a few days.

I will get the Prazipro tomorrow and start treatment on all my tanks.

I use API Stress Coat. The buckets I use are only 2 gallons, and I use Prime and Stress Coat.

My water comes from the Hillsborough River which comes from the Green Swamp. I have checked to make sure it matches my tank water, and it does. I will look for a TDS meter.

I have used these before when I took care of a tilapia who was born in space. We watched him like a hawk.

Normally I remove about 30% once a week from each tank.

[mistergreen]

hey tanja,
Check the whole head area for a small pit or hole... It could be a start of 'hole in the head' disease..

I remember way back when my rainbow had trouble swimming because of it.. The hole wasn't obvious either. It swam in circles and sometimes upside down. I think the bacteria attack their central nervous system.

[starsplitter7]

hey tanja,
Check the whole head area for a small pit or hole... It could be a start of 'hole in the head' disease..

I remember way back when my rainbow had trouble swimming because of it.. The hole wasn't obvious either. It swam in circles and sometimes upside down. I think the bacteria attack their central nervous system.

I just pulled out a magnifying glass and a flashlight, and I checked her entire head and down her sides. Even under the magnifying glass, she is flawless. No pits or holes, no frays, no extra slime coat, . . . nothing. I checked all her buddies and they are perfect too. Very frustrating. When I am not bothering her she sleeps on her back which is not normal for her. When I bother her, she flips back onto her tummy and spins around the hatcher. Now shes resting again. No hard breathing. I actually keep touching her, because she looks so peaceful, I am afraid she is dead. But as soon as I touch her she starts to spin. AUgh! I feel bad because I had to catch her bodily. My hands are clean and she feels normal.

[chefkeith]

Just an FYI, you don't need to use Stress Coat. You should try to keep the water as pure as possible. Prime is the only thing needed to treat tap water.

[starsplitter7]

Just an FYI, you don't need to use Stress Coat. You should try to keep the water as pure as possible. Prime is the only thing needed to treat tap water.

I worry about not having water well treated. Especially when I am treating the smaller tanks (ten gallons/ 5 gallons). I have 2 gallon buckets, so I only need to add .2 mL per bucket. That makes it difficult in dosing.

[Diana]

I use an eye dropper that measures 1 ml total, and has marks down to 10ths. Get it in the pharmacy department of most stores. There is a larger one that measures 5 ml, it is plastic, for dosing medicine to kids. This works well for some things. When I need to measure fractions of a ml, though, this little one is great. It even has a bent tip that helps when the bottle is getting empty: the bend tip will get the last out of the bottle when I tip it up.

[mistergreen]

I'm going out on a limb and say this is an internal viral infection.
All you can do is wait it out and not do too many water changes. Your water parameters are fine as far as I can tell.

The viral infection oddly fits the 'bloat' your other loach too. I guess depending where the infection occurs, the symptoms are different.

This doesn't sound like any parasitic infection I've ever heard. So I'm not sure what prazi will do.

I'd recommend running a UV sterilizer for a month... It's a little pricey but it'll save you all the $$$ from buying tons of meds.

[starsplitter7]

Unfortunately, I have no money. Is there an alternative to treating for a virus?

[mistergreen]

Unfortunately, I have no money. Is there an alternative to treating for a virus?

No, unfortunately.
this is the cheapest UV out there and it doesn't need to be attached to a canister filter.. You just put it in your tank like an extra powerhead.
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=16748

Think of it as an investment.. It's handy to wipe out all sorts of nasties and green water, bacterial bloom (cloudy water) too.

[mistergreen]

oooooooorrrrrrrrrrrrrrr...
you can make your own!

If you have a sump system or set one up.. And you have a light hood on the sump tank.. You can install a UV bulb in the hood.

http://www.1000bulbs.com/Ultraviolet-Germicidal/

You wouldn't want UV interacting directly with the fish.

[chefkeith]

Mistergreen- I respect your opinion, I really do, but how did you figure it's viral? From what I've read, fish viral infections are incurable. They need a host to spread. Antibiotics will have no effect on them.

You could be right that it is viral, but there is no way of knowing that for sure. I think a good option would be to look for problems that are treatable. Atleast a treatable diagnosis would give some hope.

We know that internal parasites will cause emaciation. We know they can also destroy internal organs which can cause secondary infections or bloating. They can also damage the swim bladder which can cause a fish to swim in circles. A viral or bacterial infection can do all these things too.
If this was bacterial or fungus though, I think there would be more evident signs, like tail rot or fungus on the barbels or something like that.

I wonder what the other fish gurus think? Tinman? mickthefish?

[chefkeith]

I think a UV sterilizer a good idea neverthelesss.