Clown Loach Expanding -- Please Help!

[mistergreen]

Mistergreen- I respect your opinion, I really do, but how did you figure it's viral? From what I've read, fish viral infections are incurable. They need a host to spread. Antibiotics will have no effect on them.

You could be right that it is viral, but there is no way of knowing that for sure. I think a good option would be to look for problems that are treatable. Atleast a treatable diagnosis would give some hope.

We know that internal parasites will cause emaciation. We know they can also destroy internal organs which can cause secondary infections or bloating. They can also damage the swim bladder which can cause a fish to swim in circles. A viral or bacterial infection can do all these things too.
If this was bacterial or fungus though, I think there would be more evident signs, like tail rot or fungus on the barbels or something like that.

I wonder what the other fish gurus think? Tinman? mickthefish?

You're right chefkeith*... It was only a guess. It just doesn't sound like a parasite to me though.


*edit... sorry, I always get confused with chefkeith screen name with Mick's.. they look similar to me for some reason.

[starsplitter7]

The first fish that died showed no signs of illness, besides the bloat and then hiding and being lethargic. Her color was beautiful, fins perfect, . . . and before she got ill, she was eating, swimming, playing with her buddies. This was all a week before she died.

My second ill fish has no signs off illness. She is perfection. Beautiful color, perfect fins, whiskers, plump (not thin or swollen -- beautiful condition) not a single flaw except she is spinning and resting on her back (which she never does). Her breathing is normal. She is still in the hatcher directly under the flow from the filter.

I am off to the store to pick up Prazipro for the future.

[starsplitter7]

I went to PetSmart, Petco and Petsupermarket, and none of them carry Prazipro. I looked through the medication I have and noticed a food type wormer from Jungle has Praziquantel. Of course, my fish ignore it when I put it in the water, but I thought maybe they would eat it if they are really hungry.

I was unsuccessful in finding the Prazipro (I will get it online), but I did find a eel Kuhlie (Pangio anguillaris -- I have two more with my Kuhlies and Oblanga) as a contaminate and the fish lady gave it to me for *free*. She also gave me a 3/4" black catfish that is the prettiest, cutest thing I have seen (free). She said it is Florida native, not overly predatory, grows slowly, but will be big (10"), so I have time to get a bigger tank. She showed me an 8 month old and it was 4-5". Mine is super active, not shy and swims all over the tank even with much larger fish in quarantine with it. I will get a picture to see if anyone can ID it. They are in quarantine. I bet the catfish isn't a native. We have so many invasives, and I bet they make their way right into the fish farms. She said she often gets two or three in shipments. There was also a big tadpole, sme whisker shrimp and a couple extra fish. I will go back next week and find out what those fish are. If they are free, I will take them if they are nn-fish eaters and free.

My spinning loach is still with me and still perfect except for the spinning. AUgH!

The rest of the fish are fine. I also found a Seachem Ammonia monitor that works for a year. I have that in the tank and registers at 0. So that is a back up.

I got the fish some seaweed, and they seem to really like it. My halfbeak is giving birth again. Sorry I am off topic on my own thread, but I have had bad news for so long, I wanted to post something nice.

[chefkeith]

Sorry to send you on a wild goose chase. My memory on where to get it Prazipro is bad. Come to think of it, I probably got mine at my LFS.

[starsplitter7]

Sorry to send you on a wild goose chase. My memory on where to get it Prazipro is bad. Come to think of it, I probably got mine at my LFS.

It's no problem. I got the free Eel Kuhlie and catfish.

I will try my LFS next and then the Internet. MY LFS is on the far side of town, and so I usually consolidate trips with something else.

[helen nightingale]

somehow i missed this thread. best wishes for your spinning fish Tanja. i hope you can get it sussed.

thats great news about the halfbeak and about the free fish. you are need of some luck at the moment i think. sorry i have no advice for you

[fish_frenzy]

The spinning has me thinking osmotic (sp) shock as a few months ago, I purchased 10 Praecox Rainbows from a LFS, got them home, slowly acclimated them to my water temp/ tank (well aged tank), upon releasing them into my tank, within 24 hours all but one had died. They all did the spinning/spiralling thing.

I called and spoke to my friend who is part owner of the LFS and an Icthyologist (sp again) and asked if they had added anything to the tanks different than what I did. (I should have asked this at purchase, sigh). He told me they had just added a good amount of salt to that tank this morning. I don't use salt in any tanks as I have Discus, loaches and corycats in almost every tank.

Even though I had acclimatized them, they were "shocked" due to the salt in store tank/lack of salt in my tank. Lesson learned. Just an idea in case you had changed anthing.

Tammy

[chefkeith]

fish frenzy- IMO, acclimating fish from salt treated water takes days to weeks. For sick or recovering fish, I usually give them atleast a few weeks time. A healthy fish will be able to acclimate in a a few days though.

A 40 minute acclimation from the fish bag to the q-tank is not nearly enough time if the fish is going from High TDS to Low TDS water. Testing the the lfs bag water with a TDS meter probably could have saved those fish. You should think about getting one of these meters. They only cost about $20 on ebay. It's a great investment if you want to monitor the fishes water quality.


I've also seen osmotic shock cause a fish to swim in circles. Many other things can cause this too, such as injuries and swim bladder problems. The difference here, is that osmotic shock usually doesn't happen on established tanks that get regular water changes. Something would have to be leaching heavily in the aqarium or or the tap water would have to drastically change. Also evaportation can be a factor if you just top off the tanks instead of doing water changes. A TDS meter can answer all these questions.

Here's an interesting article I found about swim bladders.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_3/ ... adders.htm

[starsplitter7]

Lost my spinning loach tonight. Augh! Still looks fine. The rest f the tank inhabitants look fine. Very frustrating.

My guppies decided to breed tonight too.

[chefkeith]

Sorry to hear it.