"Ichy" Situation Finally Under Control

[soul-hugger]

Hello...

I haven't been here for awhile because my computer is suffering from the famed Antivirus 2009, and is slowly getting worse. I have been told it is only a matter of time and money before I will have to erase my entire hard drive and start over. But this is not the place to talk about a virus of this nature....

However the other virus I have had to deal with of late is finally under control. Some of you may have read that I had brought home 3 Giant Danios. Because of the danois' overactivity, the situation ended in 2 very stressed weather loaches, and the danios being rehomed. One of the loaches, Whiskers, was much more stressed than the other. Even after the danios were gone he was never the same, hiding under the gravel under a large rock under a piece of driftwood, and only coming out for food. ( He really wanted to hide!) Then I began noticing some white spots on him, but they would be there one day and nearly gone the next. None of the other fish had them, so I thought in time they may go away with water change and TLC. I didn't want to quarantine him for fear the move and capture would only make him worse, and by this time, the other fish had been exposed to it anyway. Unfortunately this was not enough. Not only did he get worse, but the other loach also got it, though never near as bad as the first, so I had no choice but to treat the whole tank. After several treatments with medication and the subsequent massive water changes, he finally seems to be back to his normal self, playing and spending time with his friend.

This makes me feel very happy and relieved because I didn't lose a single fish, but it leaves me with a few anwers and also a few questions. This experience has told me that stress has a lot to do with disease. The danios never had ich, and they still don't. I believe that just as it is with humans, disease is at least in part, dis-ease, and that stress can be as much a factor as contact with an illness. Now that I have had a brush with ich, I am more interested to know about it and learn about it, as well as other fish diseases. But it also leaves me wondering...apart from keeping up water quality and quarantine,how do I keep it from happening again,and what do I do now? I'm wondering how long I should keep up with the medication and when I can re-introduce the carbon into the filter. It seems that you have to be o creful when it comes to loaches. Any questions, comments, advice would be much appreciated!!!
Thank-you!
soul-hugger

[valkyrie]

Glad to hear that your loaches are fine. As for how long to keep treating I have read that two weeks after symptoms disappear. But don't take this as gospel as this is second hand information, hopefully someone else with better information will chime in. But as for your comment about stress I would totally agree as the only time I have had trouble with any of my fish not just my loaches is either in times of stress or water quality issues. Fortunately I have never had to treat ick and hope I never will it sound awful.

Cheers

[Ashleigh]

Ich/ white Spot, is not a disease, it is a parasite. It can remain on fish, not visable to you for a period of time (usually in the gills). Any new fish you introduced into the tank before quarantining could possibly brought this into your tank. Its advisable, before you add new fish to the tank that an ich treatment is carried out as a precaution.

Its good that you treated the entire tank-quarantining an infected fish, taking it from the tank it was in has its own problems. The white spots you see/saw were cysts, which will then burst basically releasing more of the parasite into the aquarium-these fall either to substrate or onto decor-they will eventually become free swimming and be able to infect other fish. So if you had moved the loach, your tank would still be infected-so thats good that you didnt

You are correct about stress compromising immunity-this could be why you never saw any visable signs for a while-danios could have brought it in but were not stressed/immunity compromised for an outbreak to occur on them. The loach on the other hand, was stressed and thus an outbreak occured once the parasite was in your aquarium.

Back to your question, keep treatement up for a few weeks after all visable signs of ich have disappeared as a precaution.

Remeber in future to quarantine all new additions and treat accordingly before adding to your main aquarium-it could save you a lot of bother in the long.


Ashleigh

[Diana]

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/FA041

Here is an article and a site that has a lot of info about fish.

Ich is temperature dependent. At cooler temperatures (such as in a pond) a cycle can take several weeks. At tropical temperatures a cycle can take several days.
Maintain the medicines for 3 days in waters in the upper 70s, and a week if the water is in the low 70s (appropriate for Dojos) past the day you last saw a spot on the fish.
Continue plenty of gravel vacuuming to remove any fallen Ich parasites.

[soul-hugger]

Thanks for the replies! I am definitely beginning to learn how important it is to quarantine. I don't know about you, but when I first began, I was so excited to get new fish I could hardly help myself! But at the stage I am now, the desperation seems to be passing, and there is no reason I shouldn't be quarantining, even though this now means I will have to add a third tank to my collection before I introduce any more fish. I'm thinking a simple 10 gallon will do...or a 15, if I come across one.

As far as the medication goes, I will continue to treat, but this brings me to a third problem: I am going on vacation for a week. I did one last big water change, another medication, and have bought the feeding blocks, but I'm wondering if I should put the carbon back in before I go, or leave it as it is.... After all this work, I'd hate to come home to another outbreak! I sure wish I had a fellow fishkeeper nearby who could come and maintain it for me...

Thanks ever so much
soul-hugger

[Ashleigh]

Its worth setting up a little tank for around a month for new fish in the long run. I learnt the hard way years ago-I lost 4 6inch clown loach due to one addition-I was devestated

As for feeding blocks, scrap those-they pollute the water big time. Vacation for a week.... fish should be fine-Ive left mine up to 2 weeks-not ideal but I had no choice and they did fine-just very very happy to see me upon my return with empty tummies!!

If you had a neighbour to pop food in-prepare it before into bags and label bags for days to be fed/everyother day.
The same for treatment if possible-seperate treatment amounts into little containers and label them to be added and when.

If thats not possible, treat the day you leave and just hope the fish have recovered well enough to hold it on their own. I would not remove treatment for when you are away for the simple reason if another outbreak occuered there would be some active treatement in the water to assist until you return.

Either way, have a great vacation I go back home tomorrow and I can't wait


Ashleigh

[Diana]

The plaster looking feeding blocks are bad news.
The gel-like vacation feeders are pretty good. I think Tetra makes them.

A quarantine tank can indeed be a simple 10 gallon.
Heater
Filter
Hiding places, perhaps plants that can be sterilized or thrown away (Plastic plants or excess clippings from planted tanks)
Light
Lid that the fish cannot escape through.
Bare bottom- easier to clean when treating for anything that falls to the floor of the tank. I find a VERY thin layer of gravel works well. Not even one rock deep.

You do not have to keep the tank running all the time. As long as the fish in the q tank were healthy just put the filter on one of your main tanks until it is needed again for the q-tank. If the fish in the q-tank needed medication, and you think the filter might be contaminated you can sterilize the filter and add new media. It takes a little longer for new bacteria to grow on it.

[soul-hugger]

Yeah, I found the plaster ones made me feel very uneasy. The ones I did buy are the Tetra ones, but I got a friend to feed the fish instead. I put the food in small containers, mixed some of each type for the surface and bottom feeders, so all she has to do is dump one in every other day or so. If I have to go away again, I may try to use the feeding blocks for a weekend, at which time I can remove them and do a water change. Either that or I may just experiment with them when I am home, so I can keep an eye on how they are working. It would be interesting to keep a log for each day, and see if the fish are eating it, how they are eating it, and how long they last. Then I will know for certain if I will have to worry about water pollution, or worry that the smaller fish may not be getting a share, because some of them are growing juveniles who need to eat small amounts frequently. I opened one up and the food is in a gel form. You can see the food particles in them whereas with those white plaster things, I don't even know how that could be food, or how they would feed from it. Only other thing I didn't like about the gel one was the way they smelled.., then again, not all fish food smells very appetizing to us finicky humans...

I must say, I was very relieved my friend would come to feed them. This way, she can also check on the house, and make sure all is well.

I didn't want to make her worry about medications, so I gave them one last dose and kept the carbon out of the filter. I will most likely do at least one more treatment, even if they aren't showing spots, just to be on the safe side, when we get home.

Thank-you for all your feedback and input! I have never been disappointed in the company of loach lovers, you are a great bunch
soul-hugger

[Diana]

The plaster-like ones work by having bits of food embedded in the plaster. As the water dissolves the plaster the food is exposed. The plaster (if that is what it is) is then in the water affecting the water chemistry.

Go with the gel food. Worked fine for my friend.

[raecarrow]

The tetra gell ones work very well. Although they will usually last 2-3 times longer then the package says it does, although I was only feeding guppies. I would do a test feed to see how they do.

Good luck!

[soul-hugger]

Hello...

That doesn't sound so good, plaster leaching into the water-yikes! I'd rather not feed them at all if those were my options. I got the Tetra gel ones from my favourite LFS. The owner is very knowledgeable and helpful, and he recommended them. It is sad to see him struggling to stay in business because of places like Wal-Mart and other big box chains. There is just no way he can compete with the prices at a place like Wal-Mart, or the selection of a place like Petland. But I believe in patronizing your local LFS, in Saskatoon there are only three locally owned, one specializing in salt water only, the others are all chains like WalMart, Petland, Petsmart, and Petcetera, from where I wish I could rescue every last fish, it is so bad.

I have now gotten nothing but good reviews for the Tetra gel feeders, so I will try one out at home before I go on my next vacation, and let you all know how it works. I'm sure it will be fine, but I'm not sure if it's better than someone feeding your fish though...

I am now here in Cochrane, AB visiting my husband's parents before Christmas. We are right near Calgary, and before we leave, I would like to go to at least one aquarium store, and pick up a quarantine tank, if I can find one at a good price. I also need a stand for my 20 gallon, as it is on a makeshift one, and I don't trust it. Maybe I could find a stand that will hold both the 20 Gallon and the Quarantine. I am going to post a thread to see if anyone knows of a good store in Calgary for aquarium supplies. I really liked the idea of running the filter for the quarantine on one of my other tanks when it's not in use.

I have definitely learned a lesson and before I buy any more fish, I will have to set up a quarantine. As much as it is tempting to buy fish from the chains, I am hoping to ask my LFS owner if he would order fish for me. I tend to be attracted to the unusual, that are not often seen in the dealer's tanks where I live. I am also working on setting up a tank for my daughter. She is almost 11 years old, and I bought her an aquarium for Christmas. She seems to love fish as much as I do, and, like me, she has an affinity for loaches. It is going to be fun to help her set it up and choose the fish to go in. Unfortunately with the tank size, I think she will be restricted to kuhlis for loaches, but there are so many other choices as well. It's going to be a busy next couple of days

Take Care Everyone!
soul-hugger