ich and oxygen

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Bluebird
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:57 pm

ich and oxygen

Post by Bluebird » Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:57 pm

Type of fish that are affected -Clown Loach and silver hatchets
* How long has the tank been set up for?- a month
* Size of tank (dimensions and volume).75 gallon (unsure dimensions etc)
* How is the tank being filtered? (We have a filter..I'm not sure what this question means lol)
* Water temperature. 84f
* Your maintenance regime ( Received ich right away do water changes every two to three days.
* Has anything new been added to the tank recently? (fish, plants, live food, decor etc). everything is new ;)
* What other fish are in the tank? Khulie loaches- 3 4 silver hatchets, guppies, pleco
* As detailed a description as possible of the symptoms the fish are exhibiting (remember a photograph can speak a thousand words). Ich, depleted oxygen
* How long ago the affected fish were added to the tank, and how long the fish have been displaying symptoms. effected fish were added two weeks ago
* Your current water parameters - ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH (please don't say 'my water is fine, the levels are ok', we would like actual numbers from the test results).

nitrite and nitrate show low-0
Ammonia -0
ph- 7.5


So my problem is that when I first got all my fish one clown loach had ich right away (It came from the store I found out later) . I increased the heat, added a second air pump and used tetra ich gaurd- at half dose. This medication was horrible. It burned the loaches and my pleco.
Four of my five loaches died within days..even those with no signs of ich. I am sure it was chemical burn- as their slime was gone and they just looked peeled. It was awful.
The fifth went listless. My bf and I did a huge water change to get rid of that chemical fast! about 50%
We continued this every day until it was gone.
The clown looked okay, but was not moving around much. After the tank stabilized- or so I thought..I brought back some new clowns for him..hoping that he'd perk up a bit. When I put them in I noticed the hatchets had white spots on them. I didn't see them before I guess, because they are all white in the first place. My mistake...
The sick clown who suffered burns started coming out and looking at the new clowns. He didn't do that before. But he has ich now too. I raised the temperature- trying to get to 86f ..it's at 84 right now.
The water was changed 50% on Sunday and will be again tonight.
We didn't fill the water up to the highest point, letting the filter create more air bubbles. We have a smaller air pump on the other side of the tank..and my bf will pick up an air stone tonight.
The clown today is hiccuping- or gasping for air... He is swimming a bit, but in distress. The rest of the loaches..clowns and khulies are eating and playing well.

I'm too scared to treat with meds again...any advice?

Bluebird
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:57 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Bluebird » Tue Apr 15, 2014 11:08 pm

my boyfriend came home with two air stones and a new air pump so i hope this helps!

Craigb
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Craigb » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:35 pm

Hi bluebird. I'm brand new here, but I'm in the same boat. I know that my fist big mistake was I did not quarantine the 7 new tiger barbs I put in with my existing 6 clowns. The second huge mistake was when I was acclimating the tigers the bag was not secure and slipped into the tank, I came back to find that the water from the LFS mixed with my tank water..ugh! So thus, newbie mistake now is a rescue mission to save my 6 clowns. I'm working with 100g tank, so no small undertaking.

I too tried the same med as you...ONCE! I did a 40% dose and immediately could tell the clowns were further stressed. I left the meds in the tank for a day, then decided that after reading articles and using this website that I would change my strategy and use only heat to battle it out..I call it the 'spa treatment', lol.

Day 1: Used the Tetra med @ 40% (didn't like the reaction of the fish so changed strategy)
Day 2: Did a 25% WC (included gravel vac), raised temp from 78 to 82 over a day period
Day 3: Did a 25% WC (included gravel vac), raised temp from 82 to 86 over a day period
Day 4 - 14: Not there, but will continue to do the above heat... and WC as needed (hoping to get it to every other day)

I am noticing about a 95% reduction in flashing already, my babies are still eating from my hand and active as ever. I already had major aeration and two API XP3 filters running. I think catching it early helped...most of it is in the gills from my own speculation based on their behavior and physical appearance. I continue to closely monitor my PH and ammonia as both have raised with the extra heat.

The clowns are what brought me back into the hobby, and I'm not lettin' my little guys go without a fight. The other fish are doing well as well in the 86 degree condo, lol. I do watch my rummy red's to see if they change colors...generally if there face is not bright red when they are awake I know I've got issues going on...they are my canaries in the tank. ; )

Bluebird
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:57 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Bluebird » Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:47 pm

Thank youf or the reply.

The heat is working for me as wellI think. I lost one hatchet, but the clown who was really injured is now schooling and eating finally! He is making a huge comeback.
I think the heat really works well along with the airstones.

Bluebird
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:57 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Bluebird » Sat Apr 19, 2014 2:42 pm

Bluebird wrote:Thank youf or the reply.

The heat is working for me as well I think. I lost one hatchet, but the clown who was really injured is now schooling and eating finally! He is making a huge comeback.
I think the heat really works well along with the airstones.

The ich came back, but fewer spots and on fewer fish. I kind of expected the heat wouldn't kill them all the first round. But other forums are telling me I'm wrong not to medicate.
I have lost the battle already apparently.
So far the clowns are still happy and eating a lot of blood worms. Do you think continuing with the heat is a good option? We have no meds of choice. Just the dyed blue chemical that killed our first clowns.
Should we look for a UV light too?

Craigb
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Craigb » Sat Apr 19, 2014 7:19 pm

Are you using seperate bucks for water changes as to not reintroduce water you took out? And the water you replace close to 86 degrees? I haven't tried UV steralizers but saw one at the petshop for $70 when I was picking up a water test kit. I am thinking that would help maybe aid if I don't see improvement Tuesday. I too am nervous about using meds if I don't have to.

The heat seems to be helping out on my end...one guy still flashing but I am not through my first week until Tuesday so I hope I will be good. The fish seem to have good appitite and no unusual behavior thankfully. I have done three water changes @ 25% and each time did some vac on the sand.

Diana
Posts: 4675
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 1:35 am
Location: Near San Franciso

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Diana » Sun Apr 20, 2014 12:52 am

Ultra violet sterilizer is a good addition to what you are already doing.
38 tanks, 2 ponds over 4000 liters of water to keep clean and fresh.

Happy fish keeping!

Bluebird
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:57 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Bluebird » Sun Apr 20, 2014 11:37 pm

Oh good point about the buckets. I didn't think of that. I will look into getting two seperate ones.
I looked for the UV filter but can't find one in my area
So far I think everything looks healthier. We shall see. It must be in the free swimming stage now- no spots left.
And we are doing water changes during that every night.

Craigb
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Craigb » Mon Apr 21, 2014 10:16 pm

Diana - Thanks for the confirmation UV Steralizers are beneficial.

Bluebird - Glad things are looking better. My guys are looking great now, I have my fingers crossed for yours.

I just got through with a feeding and everyone is like an animal and now schooling together (clowns, tiger barbs, and rummy nose tetras) which is pretty awesome.

Bluebird
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:57 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Bluebird » Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:05 pm

Craigb wrote:Diana - Thanks for the confirmation UV Steralizers are beneficial.

Bluebird - Glad things are looking better. My guys are looking great now, I have my fingers crossed for yours.

I just got through with a feeding and everyone is like an animal and now schooling together (clowns, tiger barbs, and rummy nose tetras) which is pretty awesome.
no sign of ich now. so that's good. :) But do have a problem. I should start a new thread for.

Craigb
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Craigb » Tue Apr 22, 2014 10:12 pm

Hope you find your answer...this site has tons of info. I am studying up on water chemestry because I find it fascinating. And the bonus is my guys are comfortable with water changes now...they were nibbling on me while I did my water change tonight : ). I do a feeding afterwards as a comfort/destresser and one of the tiger barbs took a food from my hand along with the clowns...totally stoked right now.

When I finish up the heat treatment I can focus on doing more live plants and eventually phase out the plastic ones. That's another area I want to get into.

Craigb
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Craigb » Mon Apr 28, 2014 11:06 am

Tomorrow will be 14 days of running at 86 degrees. I noticed Saturday a few faint white spots and flashing again so I raised the temp up to 88. I have been doing 25% water changes every 3 days all of last week. I just ordered a second heater to make sure I don't have cold spots that could allow the ich to continue its life cycle.

My ammonia and nitrite are 0, my PH is high, about 7.5, and nitrate is 10. I'm wondering if I need to lower my PH with chemicals like API PH Proper 7.0, or maybe add more driftwood. The only rocks I have now are from a fish store and two river rocks.

I will continue to do heat another week too see if it improves..I know patience is key. All my fish are tolleraring the higher 88 degrees fine so far...1.5 days. They play in the currents and eating well. Continuing to keep a close eye on them. I sure hope this not a case of the heat resistent strain of ich.

Craigb
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: ich and oxygen

Post by Craigb » Tue May 06, 2014 10:57 pm

I ran the tank at 88 degrees for 6 days and now back to 86. So far things look great. I took great care to watch the behavior at 88 and they took it in stride. They are much more energetic at lower temps. They are super active with the 7 tiger barbs. The barbs seem to peck at eachother and not the clowns...yay.

The kids are eating like kings/queens with brine shrimp, krill, tubiflex and blood worms.

I plan to bring the temp down this weekend to 84 and run that temp for one week and so on until I get to 80 where I think I will keep them at long term.

I did lose some plants, but those are easily replaceable...cant wait to get new ones in.

From first hand experience heat alone can work. Patience is a must and knowing how far you can go at higher temps based on how the fish react.

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