Loaches Online Forum

I will try, but the last time it was in the photo tank, it's colours really faded (see page 3 of this thread).

Emma

Emma Turner wrote:I will try, but the last time it was in the photo tank, it's colours really faded (see page 3 of this thread).

Emma

Hi Emma

Thanks. Ive found that fishes of that colour retain their colours better when they are in a tank with a black bottom (show tank for example), with some aquarium background paper round the sides, and the fish in ntural outdoor sunlight. I appreciate that this may be too much messing about for you. It's such a rareity to see this pattern and it would be nice if we had a good side on shot showing its true colours and patterns for the purposes of posterity!

I'll do my best, but I'm not prepared to put the fish through too much undue stress. I'll see how it looks when I get him into the photo tank over the next few days.

Emma

Ok chaps and chapsesses, here's a few new shot's of Helen's loach, including underside views.....









Hopefully these will be of some help. Apologies for the scratches etc on the underneath of my photo tank.

Emma

Ive said it before and I will say it again - Stunning fish

Thank you very much Emma, and Helen.

What a beauty!! Now if we just knew what it was.

Stunning!!

Thank you. This little loach has no idea how special he is.

Emma

Bump!

Gotta ask for an update on this GORGEOUS fish!

Ever figure out what he/she is?

Good call, Katy. I'll do the necessary nudging.

I haven't read through this whole thread so maybe the explanation is already in there but could somebody explain to me why that isn't just an adult B. rostrata?

Graeme Robson wrote:I've got a 'Headache' now

http://www.petfrd.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20364

I'm afraid nobody can easily explain, I read even this, where the experts are not sure neither...

sophie wrote: are there no polish speakers here at all?

I'm not very good english speaker but i can try to translate text about Botia birdi .

Botia birdi:
"Birdi or not a birdi? Is it individual species? It's one of the most mysterious loaches from Decan. For the first time it was discovered in Kashmir by Daya (1878) as Botia almorhae but Hora (1922) suggested the name Botia birdi. Young and adults loaches, called in kashmiri language "rama gurun" , looks like Yoyo loaches (Botia almorhae). The same or similar species from the big area in north India and Pakistan is called Botia lohachata."

"Indian ichtiologist Menon (1993) identified Botia almorhae and Botia lohachata as one species but separate Botia birdi because it has got shorter pelvic and anal fins. Kulander, after analysing the Botia almorhae holotype, a lot of fish from Botia birdi species (from British Museum of Natural History) and many similar speciments from Almorha, Bengal and Chacas streams, drew a conclusion that Botia birdi is individual species. Unfortunately most of specimens analised by Swedish ichtiologist were in a bad condition, and they couldn't do precise fish colouring tests. The result of several years tests , managed by Swedish expedition, were only 3 speciments classified as Botia birdi (30.6-99.4mm long) - 2 from Jhelum river and 1 from Dal lake."

"Mirza and Syed (1995) described a big loach (Botia javedi), then recognized as Botia birdi, as brown at the top of body and creamy-coloured at the bottom, without stripes on a body but with stripes on all of the fins. Chaudhuri (1909) defined top of the bodies of speciments, constituted today a reference group, as speckled by irregular ellipses from black and brown stripes. Under that ellipses were wide black and brown stripes on both sides of the fish which ended in the bottom of the body and sometimes overlapped. Botia birdi (the Indus basin) has got shorter fins than Botia almorhae (the Ganges basin), especially pectoral fins which don't reach to the dorsal fin. Birdi loach is visually more thickset than Yoyo loach, and never generate characteristic net pattern like Yoyo's. However Kulander emphasize fact, that males have got longer fins than females so unambiguous verdict is possible after tests on more speciments. Although Menon located Botia birdi in Kashmir and Kangry (Satled basin), Kulander think it lives in bigger territory (including Kabul basin and a big part of Indus lowland (Mirza 1975))."

"However we can be suspicious and sceptic to only three speciments caught, we can't not observe the fact that Botia birdi is recognized, by taxonomists as individual species. We can find the Botia birdi name in scientific studies about animals from Indian subcontinent and in internet services regarding Kashmir water resources. Unfortunetly in spite of insistent efforts , I've never found photos of this mysterious loach.
So is it a fiction like Nessie from the Scottish lake Loch Ness or a species which in spite of it's undeniable being only from time to time appears in info-services?"

"Sometimes definitely easier is to be a sceptic and don't try to find the truth. When about 2,5 years ago, in a pet shop I saw four, small and beautifully gold-coloured loaches with characteristic black stripes , offered as "Gold Loach" I was almost sure that they were artificially coloured Yoyo Loaches. Because it was time when I didn't have a lot of loaches I decided to buy this nice loaches. I was sure that this beautiful
gold colour will dissolve after some time."

I'll translate all of the text as soon as possible.

Hey Loach Fans,

At the beginning i have to announce You something very sad. Mr Bogdan Janiczak passed away at 6.04.2011 One time when I was searching for some great info about Botias, which He was giving, i found out that His website isn't working. Then I found this sad information. It was very hard for me, cause He was a person who made me enthusiastic about loaches.

Today I translated the rest of article about Botia birdi:

"At that time i didn’t even think, that this could be Botias from different species [than B. almorhae]. Keeping them in one tank with YoYos, made possible conducting some comparative observations, which led me to some obvious statements. Primo: despite of the same environment and feeding, they have never reached dimensions, as typical B. almorhae usually reach. They also were growing slower – some YoYos added later to the same tank were quickly surpassing them. Secundo: their body is deeper than body of almorhae and they have difference in colour between the dorsal and belly: the dorsal part of the body is a little brownish, and the belly is creamy. Tertio: they haven’t developed more or less regular, bright spots (mesh of the net), what is surprisingly harmonious with available scientific descriptions of Botia birdi species.

Did specimens I own indeed belongs to this mysterious and poorly documented species? I’m not 100% sure of that. But when we rationally analyze some observed facts, the answer should be affirmative. So possibly my photos added to this description shows for the first time in history living specimens of ‘maharani from Kashimr’ – mysterious, but very pleasant and gentle Botia birdi. Look at them carefully and decide by yourselves, looking also at the picture comparing them with typical YoYo Loach. On the website of one Indian tropical fish exporter we can find a photo showing a juvenile of B. birdi (http://www.mpeda.com/aquarium/htmlorna/Index4.html), which display some basic but distinct differences in marking in relation to classic silvery-steely-grey coloured B. almorhae. My kashmirian “rama gurun” were looking almost the same [as this one on the Indian website] about year ago.

When in July 2004 I found a delivery of young YoYos with an amount of gold-glittering specimens I get the hope that history will repeat. Small group of 3cm babies found home in specially prepared tank. This time, with more experience, I decided not to wait and document the development and growth of this fish systematically. However the question from previous paragraph is still actual, upcoming months can bring some new important arguments in a discussion about mysterious Botia from Kashmir."