Hi everyone,
I bought 2 baby clowns tonight and one of them has a curved spine - he looks totally healthy but his forehead seems a tiny bit rounded compared to the normal profile you see with clowns and his spine after his top fin dips down so his body has a slight bend so his body dips lower in the belly and with his tail sticking up slightly higher.
Actually looking at the pics when I am loading them onto the website to view; both of the babies seem to have slightly rounded heads... Their eyes also kinda look big but they are not bugging out or anything just large. Maybe it is just because they are so young.
The LFS has had them for about a year and they advised me they have been healthy the whole time... Their fins and colouring are really healthy looking (greyed out right now due to the stress of being new additions).
What do you think?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/15401346@N ... 644349968/
Adrea
PS - once again thanks for your help and sorry for the quality of pics - I am still not too great wit the fish pics lol
PPS - I just put them in the QT LOL and I just realized - he is also missing his front left fin as well- when he moves you can see where the muscles are to move the fin but no scarring - poor guy is a total deformity - you would not know when you see it swim though - he swims completely strait and seems to be quite happy doing the normal loach dance up and down the tank... I am so glad I got the little guy - will try to get pics later of the profile with the missing fin...
New baby clowns - one appears to be deformed.... Pics
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I went and looked at my littlest guys to compare.
The tiniest of mine is just about an inch, SL. His forehead does bulge just a bit. I would not have noticed it, except you mentioned it, and I compared him to his slightly bigger tank mate.
The very slightly larger baby has a normal head, but his eyes are a little more noticeable.
The largest of the babies is about 1-1/2" SL. He has what I would think of as normal head shape, and proportioned eyes.
These three started out the same size. They are being treated for the parasite load that often comes with CLs. The largest has responded best, and has been growing the whole time he has been with me. The other 2 are responding more slowly, and I am trying a second course of treatment based on the skinny disease threads.
First round was just Levamisole. One responded and looks normal and is growing faster. The other 2 are slower to respond.
This round is antibiotics alternated with Prazi-Pro. The littlest guy just looked fat for the first time a couple of days ago.
Looking at yours I can see the eyes really look big. For fish that have been in a tank for a year they sure ought to be a lot bigger. Less than 2 years ago I started another set of 4 youngsters, treated them with just Levamisole, and within the first year they hit 3", and are now closer to 4+".
The tiniest of mine is just about an inch, SL. His forehead does bulge just a bit. I would not have noticed it, except you mentioned it, and I compared him to his slightly bigger tank mate.
The very slightly larger baby has a normal head, but his eyes are a little more noticeable.
The largest of the babies is about 1-1/2" SL. He has what I would think of as normal head shape, and proportioned eyes.
These three started out the same size. They are being treated for the parasite load that often comes with CLs. The largest has responded best, and has been growing the whole time he has been with me. The other 2 are responding more slowly, and I am trying a second course of treatment based on the skinny disease threads.
First round was just Levamisole. One responded and looks normal and is growing faster. The other 2 are slower to respond.
This round is antibiotics alternated with Prazi-Pro. The littlest guy just looked fat for the first time a couple of days ago.
Looking at yours I can see the eyes really look big. For fish that have been in a tank for a year they sure ought to be a lot bigger. Less than 2 years ago I started another set of 4 youngsters, treated them with just Levamisole, and within the first year they hit 3", and are now closer to 4+".
38 tanks, 2 ponds over 4000 liters of water to keep clean and fresh.
Happy fish keeping!
Happy fish keeping!
Hi Diana,
Thanks for responding.... How could you tell your baby loaches had parasites? I never thought about that.
It has been a few years since we have bought babies so I realy cannot remember how quickly they grew before. Thanks for the feedback on the growth rate and the comparison to your baby clowns. I really appreciate it!
I was just thinking that perhaps this is a genetic thing, perhaps siblings with a parent fish that also had mutations... I think it must be rare to have a bent spine and missing fin. He also seems to be a bit more outgoing than the average clown - of course our mid sized and biggest clown loaches have been acting like we have been plotting their demise since we moved last August. Whoever said fish have 30 second memories is so full of it; they are still mad at us for moving them.
Maybe their eyes are a bit bigger because while their eyes have grown with a little more normal development, the rest of their bodies have not. The pics may not show it but they are not lean by any means - I am guessing in the next 2-3 weeks, with the right TLC they should be quite plump.
Do you have any suggestions for course of action?
Thanks again!
Adrea
Thanks for responding.... How could you tell your baby loaches had parasites? I never thought about that.
It has been a few years since we have bought babies so I realy cannot remember how quickly they grew before. Thanks for the feedback on the growth rate and the comparison to your baby clowns. I really appreciate it!
I was just thinking that perhaps this is a genetic thing, perhaps siblings with a parent fish that also had mutations... I think it must be rare to have a bent spine and missing fin. He also seems to be a bit more outgoing than the average clown - of course our mid sized and biggest clown loaches have been acting like we have been plotting their demise since we moved last August. Whoever said fish have 30 second memories is so full of it; they are still mad at us for moving them.
Maybe their eyes are a bit bigger because while their eyes have grown with a little more normal development, the rest of their bodies have not. The pics may not show it but they are not lean by any means - I am guessing in the next 2-3 weeks, with the right TLC they should be quite plump.
Do you have any suggestions for course of action?
Thanks again!
AdreaOnly by seeing that they are not growing have I ever suspected internal parasites, and until I joined this site I did not know about skinny disease.
Most Loaches are wild caught, and can easily pick up parasites since they are bottom dwellers, so I automatically assume they have parasites, and treat. On the first group Levamisol was enough, and they grew really fast for the first year. They are continuing to grow, but not quite as fast as babies.
I know the Eye size is an item with Discus: A stunted youngster will have eyes that look too big for the size of the rest of the fish. As you put it: the eye kept growing, but the rest of the fish did not.
As for combined deformities, it will depend on the reason for the deformities. If there is a genetic link, then several related fish will show similar deformities. With wild-caught fish, however, how can you tell who is related to whom? A missing fin might have been injured so long ago that the fish has healed very well.
Some deformities are caused by something the eggs or fry are exposed to, so some different deformities may show up, even in genetically unrelated fish, that came from the same body of water and are a similar age.
Some deformities are nutritionally related, and marginal nutrition can show up as a deformity in one fish, while the other fish from the same stream may not show the effects.
Actually this is true of any deformities: Different fish can respond differently to similar causes. They might have been exposed to different levels of whatever it is, or one is more sensitive to lower levels than the other. In the genetic shuffle they did not inherit the same genes as their brothers and sisters. One fish's body may not process a particular vitamin as well as the next fish, so a vitamin deficiency shows up in one and not the other.
Most Loaches are wild caught, and can easily pick up parasites since they are bottom dwellers, so I automatically assume they have parasites, and treat. On the first group Levamisol was enough, and they grew really fast for the first year. They are continuing to grow, but not quite as fast as babies.
I know the Eye size is an item with Discus: A stunted youngster will have eyes that look too big for the size of the rest of the fish. As you put it: the eye kept growing, but the rest of the fish did not.
As for combined deformities, it will depend on the reason for the deformities. If there is a genetic link, then several related fish will show similar deformities. With wild-caught fish, however, how can you tell who is related to whom? A missing fin might have been injured so long ago that the fish has healed very well.
Some deformities are caused by something the eggs or fry are exposed to, so some different deformities may show up, even in genetically unrelated fish, that came from the same body of water and are a similar age.
Some deformities are nutritionally related, and marginal nutrition can show up as a deformity in one fish, while the other fish from the same stream may not show the effects.
Actually this is true of any deformities: Different fish can respond differently to similar causes. They might have been exposed to different levels of whatever it is, or one is more sensitive to lower levels than the other. In the genetic shuffle they did not inherit the same genes as their brothers and sisters. One fish's body may not process a particular vitamin as well as the next fish, so a vitamin deficiency shows up in one and not the other.
38 tanks, 2 ponds over 4000 liters of water to keep clean and fresh.
Happy fish keeping!
Happy fish keeping!
Does he look like these?
http://forums.loaches.com/viewtopic.php?t=12801
http://forums.loaches.com/viewtopic.php?t=13200
http://forums.loaches.com/viewtopic.php?t=12801
http://forums.loaches.com/viewtopic.php?t=13200
Perhaps... The big eyes look like them and the rounded dome like forehead is very, very similar but the nose is a bit longer I think... With how small they are though it is hard to tell - I wish I could see how they looked when the were smaller.
Thanks for pointing this out andre!
Thanks for the info Diana - I am going to watch for growth over the next few months and keep thim in the QT for a bit longer than origionally planned. If they do not grow as expected I think I might try some parasite treaments!
Adrea
Thanks for pointing this out andre!
Thanks for the info Diana - I am going to watch for growth over the next few months and keep thim in the QT for a bit longer than origionally planned. If they do not grow as expected I think I might try some parasite treaments!
Adrea
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