Loaches Online Forum

Emma Turner wrote:
They do use their spines during these battles, it's just that they can flex them so quickly that it is very hard to capture on camera. Both fish were quite scratched up by the end of this argument, but these sort of wounds heal very quickly in this tank (tip-top water quality ).

This is a picture I was lucky enough to capture a while back of Stripes with his spines raised. Stripes being the size he is has spines just a bit bigger than a cat's claw:


Emma

I know that they have sharp bone structure in their mouths to bite/scrape but, WOW, it is interesting you have seen them using their spikes in battle (to inflict wounds/scratches on each other I presume). I have quite a collection of Videos and pics of botias in general, battleing, and I have seen a modesta use his mouth to mark two parallel lines/scratch on my clown ( I seperated him) but I am thinking I should take a closer look to update my point on this.

Great shot with the spikes!!! I am never able, nor am I quick enough to capture one of their stretching the ocular spine moments on photo.

Thank you, but I must admit, it was a bit of a fluke! Cool nonetheless!

Emma

WOW!!!
Awesome pics!!

In my search through my archive for loaches using their ocular spines during fighting, I found some really cool pics that brought back memories but I did not find any pics of or with ocular spines. I am very interested on behaviors of loaches and I just might start a new thread on ocular spines. I am sure that someone must have a pic of them using it on each other.

The trouble is that they can erect and flatten the spines so quickly, that it is extremely difficult to catch on camera. Videoing a particularly violent fight sequence and viewing it frame by frame may yield better results.

Emma

Emma, what a trip, thanks for sharing the pics as always...I was excited b/c my little boogers came out and danced for me today...yippee. I am dying to know what size these clowns are. Let me know.

Krista

Thanks Krista. Stripes is 11" long now, with the other one he was fighting not too far off that size.

Emma

I was really laughing at the picture of Stripes and your other clown 'kissing'. I thought that right away, too! I find that very fascinating- so they feel life-threatened by eachother when they fight?
A royal rumble as it were? No true tussles between my clowns yet, but I'm starting to think Alfie is Alfette.
He's got a much broader, plump body than the other two, who are also well sized but much more tapered, and I'm seeing tuburcules on them. None on Alfie though.

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This made me very sad. One of the clowns that died from the mysterious illness had died with its spines out, so it clearly didn't go easy.
Or at least that's the first thing I thought when I saw them out. Very disturbing.

shazam26 wrote::

[img]IMO,%20it%20is%20a%20last%20resort%20and%20pure%20defensive%20mechanism.[/img]

That is exactly what I said earlier.

Nah, I think it can be used as a last-resort defensive mechanism, but my clown loaches employ the use of their spines regularly during fights, which can occur several times per week. At the moment, the largest two, Marge & Stripes are fighting most nights and they gouge big long lines over each other with the spines (heals up quickly in our water). This is not caused by decor (we have nothing sharp in the tank) and we visibly see them using the spines. Stripes actually has a little trouble in putting one of his spines back down on his left hand side, so we know he is erecting them quite frequently as this one spine often stays raised for some time after a bout with Marge.

Emma

You so funny.. All I could say is great minds think alike LOL . Stripes seems pretty feisty for going after much bigger Marge. I only fear for loaches using their spikes on each other while fighting in a cave can bore each other and become stuck or poke an eye out or somethinig. My loaches will leave one cave and fight for one particular cave (PVC tube) in there for hours. Why that tube, I dont know. There was a thread with a catfish that stabbed a loach, "Big Tail" and killed him in the cave.
P.S Does the water there heal other things quickly besides scratches?..LOL

Yeah, I have worried about the eyes on the occasions when they are fighting in more of an enclosed space. Thankfully (touch wood) they seem to know to avoid that area, with most injuries occuring along the flanks. More often that not mine will battle out in the open though, which makes for interesting viewing.

Emma

First, I appreciate the discussion we are having on this very much.. I mysely like watching them battle for pecking order or realestate, it is not like they are ripping each other apart and like you said, most of the marks go away in a few days.
Do you know if your loaches bite each other and also cause marks on the flanks with their mouths? Regarding them poking an eye out, I have never read of this here or seen it so I am not to worried about it. Have you read about anything like loaches poking an eye out on LOL?

Here is the pic that brought back some memories I mentioned finding earlier. It was taken in 2001 or so. The story behind it is, after hours of battleing between the Modesta and clown, they were exhausted. The Syncrossus usually don't mess with these two but being annoyed that it was going on in front of his cave and disturbing his rest, he decided to break things up.


The Clown was obviously annoyed by his interference so he has a raised wiskers. The Modesta is weak from the early stages of skinny disease. He had beed vomiting out his food for a few weeks around this photo. He died about a couple months later skinny as skin and bones

good timing on that shot lol! i can't ever seem to time things right and when i do, they run away when they see the camera!

These guys were so ticked that I couldn't stop them with my hands. As far as the one in the middle, I did not know he was there. By luck I got him.